I have a slightly different take on Bobby Jindal from some of my co-bloggers here at the Mutiny: I know, if I lived in Louisiana, that I wouldn’t vote for him. I just disagree with him too strongly on the social issues — intelligent design and abortion rights, for starters — to let my sense of ethnic loyalty get the better of me.
But I can’t help but be somewhat torn when I see photos like this:
The rest of the very interesting New York Times profile explains what this represents: Jindal is slowly winning over the rural white voters in northern Louisiana, staunch Republicans (can anyone say David Duke?) who couldn’t bring themselves to vote for him when he ran for governor four years ago. He’s also learning how to avoid giving the impression that he is an overachieving policy wonk (which he undoubtedly is), so as to better connect with ordinary Louisianans.
For me, Jindal’s growing success at this (again, encapsulated in the photo above) taps into an anxiety I myself have had as a child of immigrants — who became the first (and only) person in my extended family to earn a Ph.D. Even if your tastes and cultural values are profoundly “Americanized,” as mine are, there remains a sense that you don’t quite “fit,” which tends to be exacerbated (for me, especially) every time some a-hole on South Street (in Philly) mutters something about “there goes Bin Laden” when I walk down the street. Part of the anxiety comes from the ignorance and xenophobia of some Americans, but a good part of it comes from myself, an internalized sense of remaining not-quite-pukka despite everything.
If Jindal wins, his victory will suggest to me he’s somehow overcome both sides of the immigrant’s anxiety syndrome: the part that comes from others’ mistrust, and also the part that comes from himself — his own sense of being something different, something other than a “normal” American, or in this case, a representative Louisianan. If he wins, I won’t cheer, but I will, I expect, quietly feel a certain sense of pride at his accomplishment despite my strong disagreement with his kind of politics. Not just because he’s a fellow desi — it’s actually more complex than that. Rather, the pride will be because he’s a fellow desi who’s evidently achieved, after a struggle, something I’ve long aspired to do: shake that dude’s hand.
Must’ve been rich? although I don’t get the nurses bit.
that’s a dumb stereotype. republicans, on average, are wealthier than than democrats, but both groups have a lot of variation and are a coalition of many different sorts. wealthy jews are democrats while rural white evangelicals who aren’t particular affluent are generally republicans.
Hmm…I don’t think so. They certainly didn’t seem “richer” than the desis in NorCal, DC or NY. They were…average? I once would’ve said “upper-middle”, because of something silly like the number of German cars, but a recent thread on here disabused me of that conception of affluence. According to what was hashed out by some of you in that convo, these people would be solidly middle-class.
Dallas was weird for me, I’d visit these palatial, 4,000 sq ft McManses and I’d find out that they cost less than half of what my mom’s (very normal) house cost. Cost of living seemed way lower, so people seemed more well off than they probably were, if that makes sense.
Well, if he’s unfair to AfAms, then that would contradict some of that “white-washed piyush” palaver and indicate that he’s about as desi as a lot of our parents.
Anna, he (Bobby Jindal) often comes on radio, goes on his problem solving skills, financial management, people off the dole, and on saving money on the meds. His whole thing is reducing medical assistance, and that targets African Americans. His handlers (or god fathers) are very conservative white republicans (Mike Foster for example, who called him a boy genius, and gave him couple of crucial breaks).
As a political strategy, he knows being republican in Louisiana, there is no chance in hell that he will get any votes from african americans (even if ray nagin endorses him 1000 times), so it is the “others” for him that has no value in his great design.
While I understand what you’re saying here, I must protest at the implication that being ‘white-washed’ means you’re less racist toward Af-Ams. I don’t think Bobby Jindal is ‘white-washed’ and frankly don’t really care because I’ve come past such simple characterizations, but I do think he is someone who has completely bought ‘into the system’ so to speak, e.g. how he completely toes the Bush party line. And I think his race-baiting is different from our parents’ racism because a) he is a 2nd-gen (I don’t know many 2nd-gens who go around talking about how superior they are to Af-Ams), and b) his race-baiting is political, meaning it has consequences on a much larger scale.
His whole thing is reducing medical assistance, and that targets African Americans.
uh, i’m a little confused here. i can believe that something has disparate impact on AAs, but that’s not prima facie evidence that he is targeting african americans. if jindal favors policies that are slanted toward the wealthy then it will favor whites over african americans by nature of differences in distributions of wealth, but that doesn’t mean he’s pro-white, that means he’s pro-rich. the republican party is a coalition, and one faction is very pro-rich (think wall street journal), while another faction does have racialist sentiments (think tom tancredo), but you need to be careful not to confuse the two.
but I do think he is someone who has completely bought ‘into the system’ so to speak, e.g. how he completely toes the Bush party line.
i really don’t get what you are trying to say here. he’s a partisan and slavish follower of g.w. bush. so? he’s a republican, what would you expect? if hillary clinton is elected i’m sure there’ll be brown dems who toe the dem party line. what does that mean aside from the fact that they are partisan democrats?
Noted, Nala. I was implying something else entirely. 😉
but aren’t you equating desi-ness to religion/hinduism in this case?
but aren’t you equating desi-ness to religion/hinduism in this case?
to some extent, remember that i said there are many sufficient conditions, but no necessary ones. the hindu religion is an organic outgrowth of indian culture and civilization. its stories are to some extent the stories of india. that does not mean that christians, muslims, jews and zoroastrians can not be desi, but their religions are not fundamentally and inextricably indian. hinduism as it is practiced now, even universalist sects like ISKON, has a south asian cast.
i meant that if he is racist or supports racist policies/policies that happen to exacerbate racial issues in Louisiana, it’s not because he is desi, but because he is a hard-line Republican. Though there may be some overlap between the two; I don’t know what goes on inside his head.
re: hinduism, the beliefs of the balinese and the hindu chams of vietnam are two possible exceptions; it seems these are cases where hinduism has been indigenized enough so that the indian identification is somewhat less tight (and analogy might be northern european protestant christianity and the middle east, though christianity derives from the middle east and retains many of those sensibilities it has become thoroughly indigenized in northern europe).
what racist policies are you talking about?
i can believe that something has disparate impact on AAs, but that’s not prima facie evidence that he is targeting african americans
Dude, Razib, let Maitri (who actually lives in Louisiana) chime in.
He talks in lot of thinly veiled, he always has………Here is an example:
Earnest thanks to N. La. Lady who points us to a Shreveport Times opinion piece by Tannie Bradley. It confirms N. La. Lady’s original report about Jindal using the loaded rhetoric of racism while he stumped in North Louisiana during the Jena 6 demonstrations.
Initially, mominem was skeptical that Jindal would be stupid enough to use such phrasing. In a comment at this post, mominem stated:
Well, apparently, Jindal’s not “smarter than that”. Unfortunately, while I felt N. La. Lady’s report was likely true, I was much more skeptical than mominem that it would be “devastating” to Jindal’s campaign. I know for a fact that rival campaigns have been informed of Jindal’s blunder. Yet, even though these campaigns have nothing to lose, they are apparently too scared to make an issue out of it. The other campaigns (except Georges) were too scared to attend the Jena 6 marches, and now they are too scared to call out Jindal for echoing the awful loaded phrases of past segregationists (and their latter day spiritual heirs).
kush, there’s a difference between pandering to white sentiment and “targeting” african americans. like most republicans he probably wants to just focus on the white vote because he knows he won’t get more than 10% of the black vote.
Kush and dravidian lurker both pointed out some things that might suggest that he ‘doesn’t care about black people,’ though your point about him just trying to get votes that he has a chance of winning is well-taken. And like you said, it’s not necessarily ‘racist policies’ so much as policies that might exacerbate already-existent race tension, e.g. what is he going to do for New Orleans? And what he’ll do for the rich vs. what he’ll do for the poor.
But a lot of it is based on his anti-choice beliefs, which I’ve read some articles about which posit that anti-choice disproportionately hurts the Af-Am community. It might be different in the South though.
I don’t like his politics or implicit race baiting either, so probably wouldn’t vote for him. Yeah he converted, but so what. His is a first world conversion, of free will, and not third world coercion or bribery. Also, eventually there will be Hindu and Sikh politicians in the US, its more of a right state, right time kinda thing…
Even if your tastes and cultural values are profoundly “Americanized,†as mine are, there remains a sense that you don’t quite “fit,†which tends to be exacerbated (for me, especially) every time some a-hole on South Street (in Philly) mutters something about “there goes Bin Laden†when I walk down the street. Part of the anxiety comes from the ignorance and xenophobia of some Americans, but a good part of it comes from myself, an internalized sense of remaining not-quite-pukka despite everything.
I love the site, been reading it for months, but never felt like commenting until I read that. That odd feeling where you don’t feel like you even belong, that you ever will, but you pretend not to care because you’re just that stubborn…hate it 🙁
I love the site, been reading it for months, but never felt like commenting until I read that. That odd feeling where you don’t feel like you even belong, that you ever will, but you pretend not to care because you’re just that stubborn…hate it 🙁
Ghuriya — glad I could draw you out. But I’m even more glad, perhaps, to know that I’m not the only one.
But a lot of it is based on his anti-choice beliefs, which I’ve read some articles about which posit that anti-choice disproportionately hurts the Af-Am community. It might be different in the South though.
black americans have much higher abortion rates http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0764203.html
but it doesn’t matter, abortion won’t be outlawed in this country. republican politicians are often insincere in their pro-life sentiments. its de facto banning via clinic closings seems to be mostly in midwestern or rocky mountain states that are lightly populated.
wealthy jews are democrats while rural white evangelicals who aren’t particular affluent are generally republicans.
Not all of them are, wealthy jews can generally split either way. I grew up in an area with an inordinate surfeit of wealthy jews (east essex co, NJ) [link] and rural white evangelicals have ideological reasons to align with republicans. In fact, that’s been the winning strategy for republicans, appeal to the wealthy for financial reasons, hoodwink the poor and middle class on ideological reasons.
As for what the actual post is about- I can understand what Amardeep is saying. While I’m a naturalized citizen, I don’t feel American. And I’m female and don’t get comments like that anyway. I’m envious of desis who can comfortably acknowledge their Indian/whatever ancestry but still consider themselves firmly American. This is kind of ridiculous, but part of it is because I worry about losing touch with family in India, but I won’t get into that. I consider myself more a New Yorker than I consider myself an American. But maybe that’s jut typical New Yorker arrogance.
i tried to find those articles about anti-choice disproportionately hurting the af-am community, but to no avail. i actually came across a lot of sources stating that the higher rates of abortions among af-am women is equivalent to ‘black genocide.’ i think i got them confused with that california proposition that would’ve required parental notification for minors getting abortions (and how that would suck mostly for asian-am and hispanic teens).
I’m envious of desis who can comfortably acknowledge their Indian/whatever ancestry but still consider themselves firmly American.
Don’t be. from my experience, most people who firmly “consider themselves firmly” American are just as tilted about it as everyone else.
Maitri is a female name. Also spelled as Mythri. It doesnt even sound like a male name.
I dont think you can easily classify readers here. I am liberal with very libertarian leanings. I am pro Death Penalty but I am very cautious about waging proactive wars which incur a lot of collateral damage. I believe in school vouchers. I am big government when it comes to the environment and other areas where companies will not bother to police themselves but small government every where else. I suspect a lot of Indians are not as easily classifiable either because we do not have multi generational loyalty to one party here.
Heh–yep–I predict you will evolve away from that view–I cert. have.
rob, I’m curious, what made you move away from that view?
Some of the Democrats in Louisiana that are accusing him of being ‘Racist’ are themselves running a race based campaign against him. They are highlighting his ethnicity and calling him Piyush Jindal in their ads, even though his legal name is Bobby. Its obviously to suppress the white supremist vote for Jindal. Ironic.
Haha yup. That would be typical New Yorker arrogance.
driving a taxi is more honorable than trying to make a career by outflanking david duke from his right.
Well, a lot of experiences that have led me to conclude the ny-other america diff. is “the narcicissim of small differences” (heh–like north v south Cali)–not that there aren’t significant differences, but they pale compared to, say, US-Desh or US-UK, or US-China….so, ultimately crazy to think ny does not equal america. The biggest source of data has been spending time with my brother & his family in Charlottesville, Virginia. Time, I might say, required by “desi-family-values” as opposed to first-order “rob” desires–I “heart” ny!!
it’s not that I don’t think new york equals america. (because it most obviously does.) i know NY-born-and-bred desis who are proud New Yorkers, Americans, and desis. it’s just that i can’t help but feel that maybe if my parents had settled in a whiter area (instead of QUEENS for goodness’ sake) and/or had me after arriving in the U.S. and not eight years before, i would feel more american. i don’t know why.
i have a cousin, who, last time i spoke to her, said that she likes being American and that she likes living here. while i like living in ny, i’ve also seriously considered the possibility of moving back to hyderabad (or splitting time between nyc & hyderabad), and have other relatives who have done just that after living in the U.S. for the past 25+ years. there’s a whole lot going on there.
I dont think you can easily classify readers here.
that’s what everyone thinks 😉 seriously, everyone perceives their own political views to be very nuanced and beyond classifications. as it is social scientists can identify a few principle components of variation, and the left to right one is the biggest.
Not all of them are, wealthy jews can generally split either way.
since i implied that 20-40% of jews are not democrats, well yes, not all jews are democrats. but the democratic party would be screwed without wealthy jewish donors to balance out corporate america’s backing of republicans.
.In fact, that’s been the winning strategy for republicans, appeal to the wealthy for financial reasons, hoodwink the poor and middle class on ideological reasons.
you’re so materialistic! ideas don’t matter?
Anna, the picture above needs a caption contest. “United in okra”
Well how would you classify me. Not many fall into those convenient niches. They just want to but do not want to admit they are nuanced about stuff. I get into arguments with my fellow liberals about quite a few things. And I suspect deep inside, some of them actually do not fully believe the stuff they think they do. I know quite a few liberals swho enjoy unPC jokes but do not want to admit they do. They love money too.
Yeah I grew up in the suburbs (between, if I may, nyc & puli)–so Queens is a whole other ball-game, as are Manhattan & Charlottesville! And, yes, I think the prospect of moving “back” to Desh is on the table for a lot of us, even though that would have seemed really odd 20 years ago–nothing wrong with it, & reflects good developmetns in Desh. I was in bombay last week, and think my economic prospects are still a lot stronger here, though that is obviously contextual–there are a lot of rich ppl. there!
rob- scarsdale?
Pravin- i enjoy un-PC jokes, as long as they’re actually funny and not just ‘shocking.’ and i love money 😀 i want a lot of it so i can buy a bombass house someday
And I’ve let my views be challenged by reading some of the stuff on SM. I think too many people my age/in the college context overreact to anything that could be deemed even slightly offensive.
Heh–we have a winner!
I am going to reserve judgment for now about Jindal and African American race baiting. Republicans from Nixon onwards have relied upon Kevin Phillips ‘Southern Strategy’ to advance politically and race baiting of African Americans has been an important component of this strategy in the South.
The race baiting of AfAms is ofcourse insidious (eg. Reagan starting his election campaign from Neshoba County Fair in Mississippi) but it has been a constant theme for a few decades now. I dont expect Jindal to come out swinging against African Americans. If he does engage in AfAm race baiting it will be insidious and along the lines of wink wink, code words and symbolism which will not be that apparent to people who dont live in La.
I am concerned about his reaction on Jena 6 as in the comment about the the meddling of ‘outsiders’. Lets hope it ends here.
Well how would you classify me.
left-libertarian.
This is cert. the issue that makes me uncomforable aout being on the “right” in US politics. Southern Democrats weren’t so good either, 1865-c.1975. I’m not sophisicated on this topic, though–as I said, I feel uncomforable about the GOP’s actions on this–tho’ I dislike the Dem’s on a host of other issues, like trade, taxes, health-care, so I am ultimately pro-Jindal (I don’t think his pro-creationism stuff is any more than the posturing any politician does to get enough votes to win).
Razib,
Are you sure you’re not a “South Park Republican“–I am! 😉
I prefer liberal or progressive to left. Left carries more of an economic connotation to me. I am for free trade on equitable terms and school vouchers. I am not against Death Penalty. I am not a fan of leftist regimes because I find them pretty dictatorial. I noticed a lot of ABDs that I KNOW tend to be socially liberal, but economically not leftist.
With my big mouth, I probably would have been executed in Russia or some other communist country.
Amitabh – could you please clarify what is a desi name? Traditionally Christians choose names from the Bible. Often, the local language version of the Christian name is chosen. Do Irudayaraj / Varghese / Cherian / Adaikalaraj / Anna / Francis come across desi names or are they western names as well?
I wonder if Bobby Jindal believes in Immaculate Conception?
There is a HUGE Mallu community where I live, and I would need a hundred arms and feet to be able to count on my fingers and toes all the Georges, Vargheses/Varugheses, Jacobs, Cherians, Thomases, etc. I know. Not even an exaggeration (okay, maybe slightly). As for first-names, they tend to be old-fashioned (Linda, Susan, I even know a kid named after one of the knights of the round table! ;)). Are there really desis out there who haven’t met desi Christians who come from a looooong line of Christianity?
Purely out of academic interest, is bubba over here clutching a beer can? Could it be, and here I hazard a guess, a large Natty light?
I’m not Christian,but would I be wrong in thinking Christians don’t favor long-standing Christians over “new” ones….at least, not ideally–I think you are mapping some other (not un-natural) concept onto Christianity
bummer for Jindal if I’m wrong on that–but I think I’m correct.
rob- I think there’s something to be said for the fervor of the newly-converted.
I was just saying that most of the desi Christians I have met did not convert themselves, but were brought up in the religion, and I’m surprised that there are some desis who don’t realize that all desis are not like them and they are not the epitome of all that is brown (whether that is in regards to religion, or regional background, or $$$, whatever).
He looks sickly, is a sell out, and a dumbass for naming his kid Slade. Slade? WTF is wrong with this guy? What is Jindal trying to prove? Blind ambition makes people do stupid things. Seems to me his political ambitions have led him to avoid his ethnic identity altogether. He might as well go all the way with the Michael Jackson skin lightening program while he’s at it. Next thing we know he’ll change his name to Bob Ginn Dahl.