Let it go down in The Historical Archives of the Mutinous that I have officially posted way too many Paris Hilton references in this Mutiny-Wallah stint for my own good. But, gosh darn it, she makes it so easy!
The 25-year-old heiress to the Hilton hotel fortune will shoot for her friend, Anand Jon, an American fashion designer of Indian descent who is introducing a line of high-end evening wear for India’s stylish elite.“For her, India is the land of exotica and beauty. In fact, her response was: ‘I finally get to visit the exotic’. She loves Indian culture and the Indian influence on clothes,” he said. [link]
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p>Ugh. She used the ‘E’ word. Ironically, as I had posted earlier, even though we’ll be able to see her model clothes for India’s stylish elite, they still cannot watch her music video on TV….
In August, Indian censors issued an “Adult” certification — which means it cannot be broadcast on any TV channel — for the blonde socialite’s new music video “Stars Are Blind.”.jpg)
Although she hasn’t visited the country before, Hilton is well known in trendy Indian social circles and CD copies of a notorious sex romp involving her and an ex-flame can be bought locally for as little as $2. [link]
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p>Who is this desi man that runs in Hilton’s party circuit? First and foremost, he’s a blogger. Anand Jon is also a famous ‘American fashion designer of Indian descent,’ though a quick glance through his Spring 2007 collection didn’t exactly blow my LA-fashionista-mind. Maybe if Paris Hilton’s wearing it, or one of ‘India’s stylish elite,’ it would be more appealing…? Frankly, I find the gratuitous use of the word ‘exotic’ in describing his fashion as well as without seeing a brown skinned woman wearing his gear on his catwalk a little irksome.
Mr. Jon developed a passion for metals and fabrics growing up in South India, under the tutelage of master artisans and his grandmother, one of the most influential women in his life. During these formative years, his deep involvement in the Yogic disciplines set a metaphysical yet playful flavor to all of his creations. Anand Jon often pays homage to his heritage, while also embracing the cosmopolitan vibe of New York City and the raging progress of modern technology.
We can be sure that of one thing- that with Brangelina in India this year, and Paris Hilton going to Mumbai next year, that the Indian paparazzi are hitting jackpot on the tabloid photo front. I wonder if all this means Paris Hilton post-India will get inspired to add ‘exotic Hindu beats’ on her next album release… I can hardly wait.
I’ll go there.
It would.
It does.
Anyway, it is said by many that Indian women tend to be better looking than their menfolk, but this is not entirely true.
Like I wrote above, Sardars in Delhi compromise a large percentage of very good looking men, and I’ve seen some of the most handsome men I’ve ever laid eyes on in India.
Alright, count me on record. I dont like to be called exotic. I used this line before elsewhere, but I prefer to be squarely mainstream.
Maybe those men didnt mind when PG called them exotic because of she considers herself exotic in a foreign land. They dont want to upset her and ‘hopes’ to get into her pants.
I’ve never called any man exotic looking to his face. Those I found to be exotic looking were strangers to me and we did not talk.
Generally the men I talk to are not exotic looking, unfortunately for me.
Apologies but I’m going to address this not to Pardesi Gori but about her. I think she does sometimes over-step the lines by being rude and generalizing. If we were not an in a better place as Desis in the Diaspora, I think what she would say, to me at least, would sometimes grate. But, at this point its all right. I do not by any stretch of the imagination agree with her much of the time. And I do think sometimes there is a bending over backward a bit to accomodate her views. I would say that not because her views are especially anathema, but because they fall outside the consensus of the blog, which I think is unforunately always as important if not more important a criteria of any opinion’s validity.
But, thats all just to say, I also think Angelina Jolie is very hot (absurdity at the end of the comment seemed appropriate)
Anyway, it is said by many that Indian women tend to be better looking than their menfolk, but this is not entirely true.
I know, its been said by near and dear friends. Doesn’t make it true? But yeah, let the flood gates open on what’s really real in terms of the Other, racism, patriarchy and the aesthetic of the normative
🙂
I wonder, what would the Gita have to say about all this?
Abhi, that’s hot.
Regardless of how it’s taken by the receiver, I’ve never heard the word “exotic” used as anything but as a compliment by the giver. Even in the article quoted, it’s clear that the author is trying to be complimentary of Indian beauty. Not everyone is familiar with the history of orientalism and othering, so to me the intention matters much more than the technical definition of the term.
Clearly, the commonly understood connotation of the word “exotic” is positive. If someone says they have an exotic car, you usually think they have a fancy sports car like a lambourghini.
From American Heritage, the definition of “exotic” 1. From another part of the world; foreign: exotic tropical plants in a greenhouse. See Synonyms at foreign. [clearly India is foreign] 2. Intriguingly unusual or different; excitingly strange: “If something can be explained simply, in a familiar way, then it is best to avoid more exotic explanations” (Chet Raymo). See Synonyms at fantastic. [clearly India is fantastic] 3. Of or involving striptease: an exotic dancer. [clearly this definition of the word was not being used]
exoticism is like affirmative action
And yet, the word exotic can be hurtful. I have mixed heritage friends, and they do not usually like being called exotic, because it makes them feel apart from a group they feel they belong to. If you are mixed filipino and korean, for example, and you consider yourself to be a part of both communities, I’m guessing you would not like it if either a korean or filipino person called you “exotic” since it would imply they judge you, and judge you to be worth but not to be the same as them.
However, I know I am not european american and if a european american calls me exotic, in certain circumstances it would not offend. For example if it was said only once or a few times, and once she got to know me she stopped refering me primarily as “exotic”. It would be unrealistic to think that if two people are in a relationship and they are different ethnicities, it would never come up, but it would not be cool if it was a basis of a relationship.
That being said, I think the passage above from the Gita is truly getting right to the heart of the matter
Pardesi Gori is a foul race-baiter. Yes, she peppers her speech with Sanskrit, and never misses an opportunity to show off her knowledge of Hinduism. However, all this doesn’t obscure the fact that she’s only interested in India as the “racial other.” She fools many people into thinking that she speaks frankly and innocently. But, really, all she does is make grating pronouncements (which are either obvious or false) about India, which she then immediately backs up with back-handed compliments, usually of a sexual nature, about Indian men. I don’t see any difference between what she’s doing and what’s done by white men who only like submissive Asian females, or by whites who put on black-face to “celebrate” African-American culture.
Thing is, she’s already been banned several times, with good reason. But she keeps changing her IP address and her commenting handle. What the moderators should do, really, is have the courage of their convictions and, next time she crosses the race-baiting line, ban her for good, and keep doing so in whatever fashion she pops up. If a male commenter on these boards kept on writing the kind of salacious and objectifying dreck about, say, Sikh women, I can only wonder what the reaction would be. Hundreds of people have already been banned by the mods, it really is no big deal. She crosses the line again, she gets banned. What’s so difficult about it?
There are lots of people here I disagree with very strongly, but they all have the ability to converse tactfully. They don’t make aggressive generalizations about groups of people. I respect that, I deeply respect that. The interest here is in the many varieties of disagreements (and backgrounds), and in the productive discourse that emerges. But the way PG does it is wrong, wrong, wrong. It’s not appreciably different from “Welcome to America, macaca.” Except her version is, “All I want to do is fuck a macaca.” It’s a free country, she’s free to want what she wants, but do readers of Sepia Mutiny really have to listen to this ad-nauseum? (And, if someone brings this up, she’ll raise her “innocent” eyebrows and ask if it’s so wrong to find Indian men attractive.)
The problem is not her views. The problem is that, after dozens of people patiently explain why her views are revolting, she persists in egging the matter on and on and on. And on. She’s nothing but a sex-tourist. Why is this tolerated?
Is this 2006? Are we really having this discussion about why it would be wrong for a white person to exotify Indians? Why the hell are we putting up with this walking, talking faux-pas? Bah!
Um, really and truly, how many of the mutineers here or the commenters have ever actually been called “exotic” by anybody?
Ok, now that is annoying, let me explain why. Being called exotic is a lesser case scenario, no one strives for it. Like pointing out in the passage from the Gita….we all want to be known and valued for who we are, not who we appear to be on the basis of being objectified.
I’m not personally mad at you PG, I just don’t think you know better, because comments like that do betray a lack of knowledge of Desi people. No one but an imbecile actually seeks out the comment of “exotic”
By the way, Damn Well, that was great but I don’t get worked up by PG. Why let her get to you? We, as Desis are present in the wider world in which PG’s views sometimes appear progressive. I’d personally rather engage them here where the playing field is conducive to teasing apart why her views are off. If PG starts getting it and stops being, frankly, offensive, all the better. If not, its kind of Archie Bunker comedy, to me at least
And I do think if we ever get the point where PG has worn us down to where we don’t counter her views, that would be bad. Because then we would through our silence be accepting a basically racist point of view.
Maybe if everyone gets to the point where she has free rein, she should be banned. I would hate if her views become normative on this blog, because then this blog would lose its purpose and begin to further exactly the opposite purpose.
That’s just my view for consideration by the way
Hear hear. I’m with you. I’m all about going off tangents, I learn something new everytime and all about having a little fun but the verbal diarrhea some people suffer from here is getting on my nerves. I mean at least make it fucking entertaining. I know…no one cares…I’m just venting like everyone else 🙂
no, never have been called exotic. but i’ve been exoticized.
growing up as the only indian in the neighborhood i always felt a bit different naturally, and me being indian was a slight hurdle to overcome in terms of getting dates.
but when i went to college, 2 brazillian bombshell twins in daisy dukes (really) approached me at a party and were absolutely fascinated by the fact i was indian. “your land must be beautiful,” one of them said in a thick brazillian accent. “yes it is;” i said in a thick new york accent, “i would love to show you my coffee plantations.” they were intersted because i was indian, not despite. it was the first time i experienced that. it was kinda like affirmative action.
as i said earlier (i agree with your viewpoints mr you know damn well who), they should ban unnecessary bakwas…. however there are other ways of handling it.. otherwise they may also need this…
sahej:
no it’s not.. there is a difference.. and it’s just pure drama..not the fun kind either…
Sahej-
Did I say or assume desis seek “exotic” out?
I’m just wondering, with all this offense taken at the word “exotic”, how many here have actually been called exotic, or are we just having an argument based on nothing?
it’s interesting. then it gets really intersting. then it’s really really intersting. then it’s really really really intersting. then suddenly, you lose interest.
This is not exotification. Believe me, if you were exotified, you would not have any hurdles to overcome in regards to dating.
Exotification is generally meant as a compliment as explained above by Umang.
That is why I find it funny that I’m accused of exotifying desis. Generally speaking, I do not find the desis here in America to be exotic looking at all. I’ve seen the pics of all the mutineers, and while they are definetly each attractive in their own ways, I don’t find any of them exotic. So why are some of them getting their nickers in a twist?
Yes, in an above comment I exotified Sardars of Delhi. That means most of the ones that I have seen are what is called “hot” in America, which by the way, is a term that grates on my nerves.
In my opinion “exotic” is much more respectful, refined and cultured then this silly adolescent “hot”, which means what exactly?
Chickpea,
I agree with you, its not really too funny. Archie Bunker was pretty funny, and this isn’t too funny, or fun.
OK, I’m out
This is not exotification. Believe me, if you were exotified, you would not have any hurdles to overcome in regards to dating.
Exotification is generally meant as a compliment as explained above by Umang.
That is why I find it funny that I’m accused of exotifying desis. Generally speaking, I do not find the desis here in America to be exotic looking at all. I’ve seen the pics of all the mutineers, and while they are definetly each attractive in their own ways, I don’t find any of them exotic. So why are some of them getting their nickers in a twist?
Yes, in an above comment I exotified Sardars of Delhi. That means most of the ones that I have seen are what is called “hot” in America, which by the way, is a term that grates on my nerves.
In my opinion “exotic” is much more respectful, refined and cultured then this silly adolescent “hot”, which means what exactly?
PG,
You know I don’t know. I’m in sudden need of chai
kiss kiss love you bye
Exotic does not necessarily have to be respectful or refined, it’s a form of “othering” and often treads a fine line between being neutral and disrespectful
Exoticizing is dehumanizing, not in the same way racism is, but it’s dehumanizing none the less. Expecting that every Indian knows cricket, is overly spiritual and saintly, practices the kama sutra, etc.. is not much better than expecting that every Indian drives a cab, owns a 7-11, is an engineering nerd, etc.. But I won’t say it’s the same…
That is all.
This is exactly what I meant by diarreah. You can’t possibly be that clueless to know that being deemed exotic whether negatively or positively (moot issue) can absolutely be achieved by not actually saying it. It’s how people are treated, it’s how they are perceived and this is what’s really grating about dealing with you PG.
You put on this ‘I don’t understand I’m innocent’ act on when it comes to the depth of a discussion and weasel out by throwing in some Hinduism stuff or some other offtopic tangent. If enough people are taking offense to it, try to understand it if you really are clueless (which I’m convinced you are not) instead of saying shit like “are you just having an argument based on nothing”?
WTF scroll up and read all the the crap you’ve posted so far….it’s all a whole lot of nothing. What Sahej said…I can’t find a single post filled with the kind of crap you seem to pull out of I’d like to say your ass but I’m sure I’ll get banned and at this point I’m just annoyed and have to say it. Ban me.
yeah, i know. i meant the brazillan twins in daisy dukes exoticized me. prior to that, the above was my basic relationship to women, or girls at the time.
Taz Wrote:
Anyone else perturbed? Or is it just me
Well, obviously not just you, see Anna above. I wasn’t perturbed by anything PG wrote (Am I exotic? Yep, in a majority white country, I always will be). But I am pertubed by comment #133 that called PG a “sex tourist”. Seems like SM moderators are greenlighting attacks on PG the way Jack Straw is greenlighing attacks on Niqabis! (I’m going for the exotic analogy).
Anyway, nothing PG says is much different from the objectification of women by desi men on earlier threads. It’s hard to attribute the animosity towards her as anything other than the moderators’ bias.
Well, it appears to me that there is alot of defensiveness over this word, and I’m wondering if in fact there is a concrete reason for it, or if it’s like a “what if” case.
Quite frankly, i think it’s possible that some people wish they would be considered exotic just so they could have something to gripe about. Then they wonder why no one finds them exotic. Not saying this about anyone here, but I’ve seen the shoe on another foot with regards to some western women in India who complain about the hyper-sexual-exotification of western women there, and go on and on about it, when no one has personally hyper-sexually-exotified them but there seems to be a secret wish to be though of as “sexy” by Indians.
So it seems that a little of that attitude is possible in this situation also.
From Pardesi Gori’s definition ‘exotic’ is positive then why are people thinking that she is being a racist when she uses exotic for a desi? I think people need to clarify if they think exotic is “racist” to them before they gang up on Pardesi Gori cuz looking at her definition it is something positive.
Well, it appears to me that there is alot of defensiveness over this word, and I’m wondering if in fact there is a concrete reason for it, or if it’s like a “what if” case.
Are you for real? Its not a ‘what if’ thing. Everybody here (bar none) has felt left out or has been made to feel like the ‘other’ a few times in their life. Surely, you can understand this simple fact.
there’s no way out. if you think indians are hot, you’re exoticizing. if you think they’re not, well white standard of beauty. treat desis differently, you’re making us the other. treat us the same, not recogizing our culture.
we’re all freaks in a hall of mirrors. welcome to the carnival.
i swear upon on the ground that i walk upon… that i am sick and tired of the word EXOTIC used in whatever context (the good the bad and the ugly..all of it)….. can we all just PLEASE stop using it.. puhllleeeze? i’m in the process of applyinghead on…(one of the absolute worst commercials out there) okay thank you for your consideration…
i think anand jon like sandy dalal will be a nobody tomorrow–he isn’t that special..and is not one of those designers that we will be seeing um..3 years from now? … why paris hilton wants to go to india? who the hell knows… i’m surprised she hasn’t been there already..
Yeah, and since I don’t find any of the mutineers here or any of the commenters who’s pics I saw to be exotic, either in a positive or negative way, I don’t understand the big deal.
And now everyone don’t jump on me for saying you’re not exotic. I do find all of you to be nice looking.
OK so that means EVERY HUMAN ON EARTH has been exotified!!!
Sorry, but that is SO NOT the meaning of exotic.
I feel left out and “other” every day of my life, everywhere I go.
Hello! Does that make me “exotic”? Not.
And now everyone don’t jump on me for saying you’re not exotic. I do find all of you to be nice looking.
WTF! Stop your patronizing crap. Its too obvious and crude.
Kobayashi?
this girl i knew in high school always misused the term “pet peeve” cuz she thought it meant your favorite quality in a person, not things that annoy you. when she told one of her boyfriends that one of her biggest pet peeves was honesty, he was like wtf?! bad example, but true story. isn’t the same thing happening with the word exotic? people may have good intentions when they are using it, but it’s interpreted negatively by the receiver and therefore people get upset? that said, once that girl found out what the meaning of “pet peeve” really was, she felt embarrassed and started to use the term correctly. a word like “exotic” to me may not have one concrete meaning, and while i don’t find the word on its own offensive, it is a term that does upset the majority of the commenters on this thread and out of respect for that, i wouldn’t go around calling angelina jolie exotic in this environment. to me, that’s just social tact.
yeah, cruel…but funny. so all good. PG might even embrace it, she’s good that way. It’s #113, btw.
Probably it’s a case similar to this;
http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/archives/002544.html#comment96299
My guess is that most of those getting in a twist have never been called exotic before.
Not me. But ehh.. I am a FOB. I dont really count because I never had to face the issues most ABDs seem to have faced growing up. Lucky me. You can exotize me all you want. Afterall I will always be “othered” no matter what.
Personally, my pet peeve is when people talk of desi accents. Everytime someone, especially ABDs make any kind of remark about accents(even if it is said in fun), I say something rude like, “And you think you speak like the Queen of England or what? Dumbfuck”.
Its all about our own issues, not what other people say. I am sure the Gita says this somewhere; albeit more eloquently.
Good comments were made.
Bad comments were made.
Good rebuttals to being exotified made. Live loud and proud brownz, don’t let your voice be stifled by the white woman! [brown fist in air]
I am gouging my eyes out here moderating this thread.
I gots more important things to do in my life than moderate a thread catering to the exotic banter of PG.
If you gonna be all ignant and can’t play nice, than maybe you should find another playground to play on.