66 thoughts on “If Spiderman were a sex worker

  1. at least my read is that the masks are a matter of shame. i’ve commented in another discussion

    i think it is not right they were wearing masks. it is the bigger problwm. suggests an element of shame or public hypocrisy around the profession. sex workers are marginalized so they do not have access to some of the societal protection that some of us take for granted. it dehumanizes the women (and men) in the profession and the johns feel it is within their right to abuse the sex worker.

    i feel prostitution should be legalized and recognized as a legitimate industry to dissipate the abuse and control the health risks.

  2. As is consistent with that video, the prostitution scene in India is unbelievably horrible and nasty. Enough so to cause most of the potential indulgers with any money to Dubai or Thailand, where they can be seen in abundance.

  3. If I saw that video without knowing the context, I would have thought that the tough economic times have forced the outsourcing of all superhero roles to India.

    BTW, this is not the golden age for Indian men. We can’t beat up our wives and now it looks like we can’t beat up our prostitutes either.

  4. “No,” you misread that article–those crazily high prices demonstrate an excess of demand over supply–causing “most,” I reiterate, to head for Dubai or Thailand (whilst avoiding the disgusting low-level scene).

  5. causing “most,” I reiterate, to head for Dubai or Thailand

    Just what is your source on this? How do you know what percentage of wealthy Indian “Johns” are flocking to Dubai and Thailand? What are your numbers?

    I’m curious to know where you are getting such valuable information on Indian men especially because it is hard enough to get basic information on European “Johns” who fuel the largest prostitution and trafficking market in the world (Eastern European women and child prostitution) and who fuel the largest child rape market in the world (Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam).

    Since numbers are hard to come by even in these highly watched markets, the centers for tracking missing and exploited children and women around the world would love to know what you are pulling your conclusions out of.

  6. you misread that article–those crazily high prices demonstrate an excess of demand over supply

    No, I didn’t misread the article; you are just making speculative conclusions based on nothing more than assumptions about “crazy high prices” and “demand” (what’s the average going rate for high class prostitution in India and what are your sources?) and making unsubstantiated assertions about where “most” rich Indians are going for their prostitution needs.

  7. I don’t have any hard #’s; just (1) conversations with (relatively high SES) men during trips to India, where they bemoan (a) the horrific local low-level scene (which does involve trafficking (typically from Nepal, though a focus on border-crossings is misplaced, as there is plenty of intra-India stuff going on) and coercion, and so they avoid it) and (b) the (by global standards) crazily high prices for anything safe/desirable/legitimate, and (2) observation of large groups of Indian men (who are not construction workers!) in clubs in Dubai and Bangkok. I look Indian myself (I’m ABD) but I’m confident those groups were Indian nationals. In the Bangkok club-scene there is some discrimination against Indians; in Dubai the anti-Indian stuff is more subtle if you have some money.

  8. I don’t have any hard #’s; just (1) conversations

    Next time try to not make broad generalizing statements based on personal fantasies anecdotes.

    And to your ABD pals — if they are that hard up for sex that they bemoan a) the lack of services in India, b) high prices globally (nothing says loser like a whine about the high prices), c) have to hit up “clubs” in Thailand, tell them to save on the plane trip and just hit the Las Vegas strip or any number of escort services in Beverly Hills or Manhattan. Hell, if they are that hard up, they can just troll 4chan to get free hook ups with college girls (although Indian men on that board are pretty regularly mocked and told to GTFO).

    Alternatively, you your “friends” could get some social skills and not be such a noob at life — Wait, whaaaaa-?

    in clubs in Dubai and Bangkok.

    SO TRUE. All women in clubs are prostitutes. If personal anecdotes of “observation of large groups of Indian men” weren’t persuasive enough, this conclusion definitely is.

  9. ‘”No,” with all due respect, you misread again: (1) I didn’t complain about “high prices globally,” I merely pointed out that the price for non-disgusting paid companionship in India is ridiculously high by global standards (thanks, Victorians!!). This leads many Indian men to frequent the much more reasonably priced locales of Dubai and Bangkok (where the supply is much higher than in India). Obviously, a lot of people disapprove of this (and they may or may not be correct), but stop denying the reality of it.
    (2) Your invocation of Las Vegas is again badly missing my point–I’m merely observing (not consuming) the difference between places where paid companionship above a certain minimum level of hygiene/etc. is available for a reasonable price (e.g., Dubai, Bangkok) and where it’s not (e.g., Delhi, Las Vegas). (3) The women at the clubs in Bangkok and Dubai are, in fact, generally “available,” they will just ask for a bit of “taxi money” in the morning (hehe–it’s like the taxi fare from Manhattan to JFK, though, in Bangkok, and 4x that in Dubai!).

  10. Let me spell it out: All your “conclusions” about available women and the going rate for prostitutes in Delhi, Las Vegas, Manhattan, Dubai, Thailand, or anywhere for the matter are based on nothing more than fantasy and lies.

    I merely pointed out that the price for non-disgusting paid companionship in India is ridiculously high by global standards

    Again, what is the “global” rate for “non-disgusting paid companionship”? How do you know what the rate is? No, your “friends” are not reliable sources? What is “non-disgusting paid companionship” anyway?

    This leads many Indian men to frequent the much more reasonably priced locales of Dubai and Bangkok

    Oh, now we have moved from “most” Indian men to “many.” You learn fast, grasshopper.

    What is “reasonably priced”? You have demonstrated already that you don’t have ANY EVIDENCE that Indian men are going overseas for sex or what the going rate is globally for “non disgusting companionship.”

    The women at the clubs in Bangkok and Dubai are, in fact, generally “available,” (hehe

    You have no evidence to support this. How many women in clubs in Bangkok and Dubai have your friends surveyed? How many clubs did they review in these cities? How many clubs around the world have they cross-checked to evaluate global rate in Delhi/Las Vegas versus Dubai/Bangkok?

    Also, since hooking for FREE is ridiculously easy in most clubs around the world, what percentage of phail-at-life losers only get women who ask for “taxi money.” How do they know that “women at the clubs” are generally available for cash when they can’t hit the free ones anyway? You need to factor in the loser quotient here, unless your premise is “all women in clubs = whores.”

    4x that in Dubai

    Really? Four times in Dubai? How did you come up with that number? Four times compared to what base line price? In what city? According to what standard?

    While you are crunching numbers, let us know many of your friends frequent prostitutes. What percentage of Indian men do they represent? What percentage of Indian men frequenting prostitutes do they represent? What percentage of the global prostitutes have they used? How many prostitutes from Dubai and Thailand have they averaged?

    MAKING IDIOTIC STATEMENTS. YOR DOIN IT RITE.

  11. Uhhh, “No,”—why are you so determined to be absolutely wrong? My info. is correct, see, e.g. worldsexguide.com if you disagree. I was pretty clear that with respect to Dubai, “4x”, means that the “taxi money,” in US$, averages about four times what it does in Bangkok. This is why you will see a lot of Indian men in Bangkok! You will see me there too–I like to combine business trips to India with some beach-time in Galle (Sri Lanka–with some occasional German-tourist-girl action) and some, well, “fun” time in Dubai (or, even better if I have enough time) Bangkok.

  12. Look, when I say “most” Indian men with some money go to Dubai or Thailand for their fun–yes, you can endlessly raz me if you want to–by “most’ I mean “most” of the men I know in India–obviously, that is not the average Indian man–but, I think it approximates the Indians who read my posts—no?

  13. 17 · No Let me spell it out: All your “conclusions” about available women and the going rate for prostitutes in Delhi, Las Vegas, Manhattan, Dubai, Thailand, or anywhere for the matter are based on nothing more than fantasy and lies.

    Uhhh–sadly enough,everything I’ve said here is the stone-cold truth. Life has its nasty side, yes, but I’m surprised that you need to lie so much about me.

  14. You will see me there too–I like to combine business trips to India with some beach-time in Galle (Sri Lanka–with some occasional German-tourist-girl action) and some, well, “fun” time in Dubai (or, even better if I have enough time) Bangkok.

    Time to report you (and your ilk) to VHP’s anti-fun cell. But wait, do the same rules to NRI funders?

    Look, when I say “most” Indian men with some money go to Dubai or Thailand for their fun–yes, you can endlessly raz me if you want to–by “most’ I mean “most” of the men I know in India–

    Sample size. and yours is just too small my friend.

    obviously, that is not the average Indian man

    Sadly, the German backpacker also concurs.

    but, I think it approximates the Indians who read my posts—no?

    Aww, Rob, the spokesman for poor little rich boys everywhere.

  15. everything I’ve said here is the stone-cold truth

    Oh dear god.

    Seriously, after two hours of feverish google searches you came up with worldsexguide.com? OH COME THE F ON. You fail at the internet.

    Let’s see. Your sources have gone from acquaintances, to more acquaintances, to worldsexguide.com, to personal experience with German-tourist-girl action . Yes, you are living it up with high paid girls on Uqbar. Yee-up.

    Next time, treat the horrific world of sex trafficking with a lot less asshatery by staying away from making snide remarks about how to get girls (wink, wink) by paying a better price for them.

    READ THE BLOG POST. It’s about WOMEN WHO HAVE TO LEARN TO DEFEND THEMSELVES from MEN. Putting down your cyber fantasies about hooking up with Arab and Thai girls (dude, in your cybers you should totally not be paying) in Dubai or Thailand is SICK.

    but I’m surprised that you need to lie so much about me.

    Nah, you’re doing a bang up job on your own.

  16. fantasies about hooking up with Arab and Thai girls (dude, in your cybers you should totally not be paying) in Dubai or Thailand is SICK

    Uhhhh–just for the record,the women in the clubs at 5-star hotels in Dubai (no idea about the mix at low-end places in Dubai, but I doubt they’re Arab either) tend not to be Arabs–probably, in decreasing propensity: 1) Central Asian from former USSR (Uzbek, Kazakh, Tajik, etc.), 2) Russian/Ukrainian/Romanian, 3) Chinese, 4) Ethiopian/Eritrean, 5) Iranian (Persian and/or Turkish), 6) Moroccan (more often Berber than Arab), 7) Arab (usually Palestinian or Lebanese).

  17. READ THE BLOG POST. It’s about WOMEN WHO HAVE TO LEARN TO DEFEND THEMSELVES from MEN.

    I have agreed since my first post on this thread that the prostitution scene in India is “horrific.” I would never get involved in it. I support efforts to rescue the women caught up in it. None of that has an ounce to do with the “scene” in 5-star Hotels in Dubai or the scene for foreigners in Thailand (I don’t doubt that the scene for locals there gets as horrible as it is in India).

  18. None of that has an ounce to do with the “scene” in 5-star Hotels in Dubai or the scene for foreigners in Thailand

    Not really.

    My only regret about this thread is that, had it happened a couple weeks earlier, maybe David Carradine would’ve paid heed to rob’s advice and not gone it alone in a Thai closet.

  19. maybe David Carradine would’ve paid heed to rob’s advice and not gone it alone in a Thai closet.

    Wow, Rahul, I kind of thought you a reasonable person–that seems like a really nasty comment–to each his own, I guess. I’m pretty sure my comments on the reality of Bangkok (where there are in fact tons of desis) has little to do with Carradine’s death.

  20. OK, so, given that Carradine apparently died of autoerotic asphyxiation, this tells exactly what about the “life” that is available in Bangkok?

  21. what about the “life” that is available in Bangkok?

    well, maybe carradine would have been alive today if only he had spent some taxi money like you suggested. Don’t get so upset, rob. I am glad to see evidence of Hindutva’s expanding tent.

  22. In any case, as my link in the very same comment indicates, life (or “life”) in Bangkok or Dubai or anywhere else isn’t exactly roses for those who benefit from your patronage.

  23. Rahul, You normally seem like a reasonable commentator,so I’m not sure why you’re trying to introduce Hindutva here.

  24. You normally seem like a reasonable commentator,so I’m not sure why you’re trying to introduce Hindutva here.

    so i could make a double entendre about its tent. a tent is often used to allude to the ability of a platform to accommodate many viewpoints, and i believe this thread adds an interesting thread to the multicolored tapestry of aforementioned platform. a tent also refers to (now, ladies, please leave the room while we men talk about this) the contours that a boner makes in the trousers of most males.

    ugh. so much explanation. may this exquisite joke rip with david carradine.

  25. I am glad to see evidence of Hindutva’s expanding tent.

    Rahula , you seem quite ready and eager to do the “Tentum sharanam gachchami”. Good for you.

  26. None of that has an ounce to do with the “scene” in 5-star Hotels in Dubai or the scene for foreigners in Thailand (I don’t doubt that the scene for locals there gets as horrible as it is in India).

    Maybe; maybe not.

    Do you check to see if your escort’s immigration papers are in order, before you begin the night’s programme? Sensitive foreplay, indeed.

  27. you seem quite ready and eager to do the “Tentum sharanam gachchami”

    No, you misunderstand me. I was observing that Hindutva’s miniscule tent made it quite pathetic, which is why I support its expansion.

  28. Stick to the thread topic or be banned. Rob, you have used up 8 of your 9 lives derailing my blog posts. Make sure every comment you leave on any thread is well thought out.

  29. Why does everything on this site turn into a pissing contest?

    It’s a video of fat 3rd world prostitutes fighting in spider man and winnie the pooh masks and you guys have NOTHING?

    How can these women be so poverty stricken when they look like they eat about 1500 more calories than I do in a day?

  30. Rob, Shallowthinker: either you guys are really ignorant not to know cruelty that goes behind with all kinds of prostitution, and if you know and condone it, and talk of it with such shallowness, then it is much much worse. Prostitution (both in third and first world) is the modern day slavery, that law-enforcement agents are struggling even to come into terms of its giant scale. Here‘s a piece of Kristof that covers a bit of its barbarism (watch that video too), and he covers a lot in his columns on this topic, here. Siddharth Kara has a great book on this modern slavery that you (rob/Shallowguy) are making a mockery. Here‘s the author’s interview, you two should see it before calling them fat and what not (maybe a lot of them are made to eat because Indians like non-skinny prostitutes ?…by your logic, poor Mexicans who look fat are not poor?).

    Abhi, the video indeed looks funny with the masks, but I couldn’t bear the callousness of some of the commenter. Disgusting!

  31. the rob bashing here is out of control. clearly its rahul who derailed this thread with his obsessive focus on rob’s tent and Rob’s unwillingness to make it a larger as to accommodate Rahal. when prevented from climbing under the covers he then whines that that expanding structure he one looked upon with so much awe is actually too miniscule for his taste, like a 14 yr old rejected by Alex Rodriguez.

  32. @ Zee

    Am I wrong to picture someone who is malnourished, when I think of a prostitute in a 3rd world country and then have my image broken by seeing the exact opposite?

    And for the laughing at something serious issue. You have to look at context. Laughing at prostitutes learning how to fight in spiderman masks is funny as hell.

    Laughing at someone being beaten to the point of them begging for their life or laughing at someone tell their sad story, shows a lack of compassion.

    I personally dont see how anyone can have only one emotion when it comes to anything.

  33. Wait, I forget. Is this Sepia Mutiny or Fark? I really can’t tell the difference. How on earth is this about where to get the best bargain on “ladies of the evening” ? Even Shallow Thinker’s comments about how the prostitutes don’t have sharp knees are more on topic than the club demographics in Dubai or Hindutva. So, coming back to the topic at hand, some discussion starters:

    1. Why are they wearing masks? I honestly have no idea. Was it just for the camera, so their faces won’t appear on BBC? Or is this a typical part of the class?

    2. Shallow Thinker is right – those girls aren’t thin. I am pretty sure a lot of girls are in this trade because it is the life they know, not because they have no other option/poverty drives them to it. Plus, if they have access to NGOs providing karate classes, they may also be some of the few sex workers out there who have NGOs looking after them, and so they might be treated better/fed well/etc. than most people in this profession. Hopefully it’ll catch on and be perpetuated by people on the inside. Volunteer organizations are all well and good, but changing the lives of 100 people won’t change the whole tide.

    Or maybe they just have clients who like their women Rubenesque. :P

    Also, the Intel commercial preceding this was awesome.

  34. Why in the world should these women be malnourished? They are working and earning therefore they should eat as they like!

  35. Also, since hooking for FREE is ridiculously easy in most clubs around the world

    NO, since you’ve grilled Rob for evidence in his claims, where is the evidence from you that hooking up for FREE is ridiculously easy in most clubs around the world. Have you been to most clubs around the world? Have you hooked up with most women in most clubs around the world?

    You accuse Rob of accusing most women in clubs of being available for sex for pay (i.e. claiming most women in clubs are whores as you claim he claims without proof, but you go so far as to accuse most women in clubs of being available for sex FOR FREE????!!!!!

  36. the rob bashing here is out of control.

    I agree. I also feel that Abhi’s lashing out at Rob is in poor taste. In previous posts I have seen anti-BJP/ Modi bashing come out of nowhere, right at the begining and continue on without moderator intervention. (Take a bow Rahul) Now it seems ok to flame someone because they have supported non-leftist ideas in other threads. And the person getting flamed is warned off?

    B.T.W. I did see the video without and later with the sound on. Found it interesting, but not humourous. The use of masks made perfect sense given the context, and karate is far too much a part of today’s culture for the actions to look strange. The use of the nunchucks was cool, although probably impractical.

  37. Abhi, My apologies for derailing the thread. I was trying to highlight that, while the topic of prostitution in India is perennial, it is these days (aside from the horrible low-end) being conducted outside of Desh (and, to be clear, I’m not at all comparing clubs in India or the US to those in Dubai or Bangkok–totally different clientele). Sorry for over-emphasizing this, though. I do find it ridiculous that groups with names like “Coalition Against Trafficking in Women” are lobbying against legalization of prostitution, which seems to me to be the obvious way to enable cracking down on the admittedly horrific sides of it–you don’t have a lot of violence associated with the wheat or insurance industries, but you sure do with cocaine.

  38. (Take a bow Rahul)

    Thanks, dizzy. Always happy to. Piss poor example, though. My comment was as relevant as the comment to which it was a response.

    I am happy to cop to bringing up rob’s funding and boosting hindutva in india while living the “life” in this thread, although I am unsure which part of it was bashing.

    Now it seems ok to flame someone because they have supported non-leftist ideas in other threads

    Yes, I agree there is all a vast conspiracy afoot to keep down the capitalists :) Well, the totality of a person’s comments are crucial in the online community to build credibility, it is unclear why the same totality can’t be alluded to when it brings up interesting inconsistencies.

    Anyways, my last comment on this meta discussion here. For what it’s worth, and not knowing where Abhi is specifically coming from, I have no interest in rob being smacked down by the moderators.

  39. I do find it ridiculous that groups with names like “Coalition Against Trafficking in Women” are lobbying against legalization of prostitution

    Actually, from the link you include, they seem to support the Swedish model for Mexico and India, which actually makes only the buying of sex illegal, not the selling of sex. This has actually been considered to be a successful model in Sweden – the argument against blanket legalization, coarsely, is that society should not legalize something immoral, I personally don’t buy this argument, but the Swedish argument has, I think, by observable metrics, both reduced the incidence of prostitution, and the instances of violence against sex workers. (The argument against the Swedish model is something to the effect of “when buying sex is illegal, only illegals will buy sex” – that, the clientele under such a regime is disproportionately on the seedier side, which seems logical, but I do not know what the empirical evidence here is).

  40. Shallowthinker, the jokes about girth of these unfortunate women just doesn’t seem appropriate….even if some of this women might have picked up this profession as a last resort. It really amaze me, that in this forum people are so very vocal against child labor/maids in India, but are absolutely callous against child prostitution (yes, most of these women are usually in their teens or early twenties or sometimes younger than teens). Would you be joking about the rotundness of slaves ? Believe it or not, most of these women are slaves, of their misfortune as well as of gangs.

  41. 48 · zee

    Zee, I don’t mean to downplay the problem of coercion in the sex-industry (it does exist!), but you can’t just rely on examples like that–there are too many mid-20′s women willing to go on a long beach-front vacation (sans pimp) for that to be true–nuance, please!

  42. problem of coercion in the sex-industry.. nuance, please!

    Here.

    The United Arab Emirates, of which Dubai is the second-largest member, is on a U.S. State Department watch-list for failing to take “meaningful steps” to end trafficking of women for prostitution and other workers trapped in conditions of slavery. There are an estimated 10,000 victims of human trafficking in Dubai, according to the department’s 2007 report.

    Here.

    In Thailand, trafficking is a Bt500 billion annual business, which is 50%- 60% of the government’s annual budget and more lucrative than the drug trade. (Authorites and activists, Kulachada Chaipipat, “New law targets human trafficking,” The Nation, 30 Novermber 1997) Twenty years ago, Thailand was in the forefront as a sending country for trafficked women. Thailand has now become a destination country, receiving women from Russia, Yugoslavia, Poland, and the Czech and Slovak Republics, South America. (CATW – Asia Pacific, Trafficking in Women and Prostitution in the Asia Pacific)