As Ennis mentioned in the earlier post, there isn’t much we, as American bloggers, can add to the story from Mumbai as it continues to unfold on the ground. The time for blogging about the specifics will come in the next few days as more facts emerge. I recommend forgetting the news channels with their endlessly repeating video loops and paid talking heads. The best place to follow what is happening in Mumbai is to visit the wiki page created to compile all information about these attacks. It is continually being updated and the references section is terrific. There is also a Google Map of the region that has been created with all the attack sites highlighted.
Twitter has also been a great way to get details about what’s going on. Try typing Oberoi for example. “Terrorists trapped” also results in a slew of Tweets.
USE THE COMMENTS TO POST INFORMATIONAL FACTS or WORDS OF SYMPATHY ONLY. RIGHT NOW IS NOT THE TIME FOR RECRIMINATIONS.
There seems to be an extreme lack of leadership from the PM or anyone at the center in this crisis. Judging from all the recent terror, India is at war and there is no effort to keep the public informed or butter confidence. The only hint of leadership is coming from Modi for what its worth.
From the media it does seem that there may be confusion and some security lapses with people roaming around near the hariman house etc however its probably best just to wait and not start criticising the indian forces so rapidly. Certainly one Brit who was holed up in the Oberoi for 40 hous Mark Abell stated on msnbc how the people were so great in helping each other and praised as he says’ the people of India’.
Please no more pro or anti-Modi comments. This isn’t a political post.
because it’s not even over yet. i think the media and politicians are doing enough speculation and analysis for the time being. and not every forum that discusses the situation needs to focus on political elements. in a situation like this, i am glad the SM is a safe place, esp. for those mutineers who are just looking for some comfort in this traumatising time.
A fact : From the news reports there is a very good possibility that the ISI could be involved in this. WTF: Why are the Indian officials allowing the head of Paki Intelligence to come “help”???
I mean WTF!!!
A real hero. Sandra Samuel
http://www.bostonherald.com/news/international/asia_pacific/view.bg?articleid=1135275&srvc=rss
It is important to note that the 140+ dead include Indians, Americans, Britons and possibly other nationalities. The religions represented include Hindus, Jews, Christians and Muslims and, likely, members of other faiths. Like a previous poster said, let us honor the dead and urge calm and restraint in forming accusations and judgments. This is a tragedy for everyone involved, as are all attacks. Let us stay informed and, above all else, empathetic.
I live in D.C. and would like to attend a candlelight vigil here in support. If anyone in D.C. knows of any such event, or would like to organize one, email me at freelancer1211@gmail.com
As a Pakistani, I don’t even know what to say. These acts are without doubt despicable, disgusting and completely unjustified. I know that a lot of people are pointing the finger towards the ISI for providing assistance to the attackers, which is all fine considering the history of such attacks, but don’t confuse the ISI for all Pakistanis. As someone who grew up in Karachi in the 80’s, we are all too familiar with the brutal tactics of the ISI, which doesn’t answer to anyone but it’s cabal of leaders in the military. Hell, the military uses the ISI to spy on the civilian government and goes as far as it needs to in order to undermine it.
That being said, what from I’ve heard from people in touch with ISI sources – they’ve lost control of the monster they created. Of course, to be taken with a grain of salt.
The terrorists need to go to a cuddle party with Tania Rashid.
198 · surya said
surya, I have to agree about twitter, there is way too much unfiltered garbage on that feed, which might be interesting sociologically, but really limits its usefulness as an information source. I have mostly relied on rediff, which has been relatively up to date, and allows me not to have to deal with watching Burkha Dutt.
Pranab Roy should fire Barkha Dutt.
Why is the media calling it India’s 9/11? What about 11 July 2006 bombing of the trains? Is it because the like of Pranoy Roy, Rajdeep Sardesai and Barkha Dutt are more likely to stay at Taj or Obroi than travel by the mumbai local?
202 · Vic said
Manmohan Singh is not a leader; he is merely a placeholder who is keeping the chair warm for the heirs of a political dynasty. I wonder if this guy is capable of breaking the wind let alone breaking the shackle of terror before seeking ‘Madam’s’ blessings.
If you take a look at the list of dead and injured, you can clearly see that the terrorists were pretty indiscriminate about who they killed. A third of the list are Muslim names, several of them women.
212 · thetrickisimple said
Yeah and he should hire Greta Van Susteren and Nancy Grace for objective live covering.
216 · saa said
IK said fire Barkha Dutt not hire Greta Van Susteren and Nancy Grace.
I am a Mutineer currently vacationing in Calcutta & have been following this on TV. A few observations: – Comparing the Indian TV coverage with US post-9/11, I miss the calming presence of a Rather/Jennings/Brokaw. The anchors are strident & obvious (“Enough Is Enough” is one of the catch phrases), the ‘live-on-the-street’ correspondents excitable & voluble. It is hard to find a sober & considered examination of what’s going down. With every channel focusing on the 3 hot spots (Nariman House, Taj & Oberoi) & cutting between them, observations are left unfinished & unformed. Too much of contradictory & confusing information with human interest ‘survivor’ interviews not adding a lot to the coverage. – The PM took a really long time to get on live TV & address the country (about 20 hrs after the attacks began). – Narendra Modi stood in front of the Oberoi this afternoon, while operations were taking place in & around it, to say how disappointed he was with the PM’s speech (imagine a Romney standing on ground zero on 9/11 & giving a speech about Bush’s incompetence).
– State elections are on at Delhi, Rajasthan & Madhya Pradesh & with this event the ruling coalition is bound to lose for being ‘soft on terror’. – Security is a joke in crowded places in the metros. It is impossible to coordinate & organize with the immense number of people milling about (eg. the junta gathered around TV cameras) & we survive on a prayer whenever we leave home. – Somini in NYT wrote that Israeli medics were the first to enter nariman House & confirmed the number of deads. Indian TV never mentioned that. This is not the first time this has happened in Bombay, or India, but everyone I heard feels this is a watershed & there will be visible changes in how we do things in India now. I hope everyone keeps a cool head & doesn’t jump to conclusions & take positions without considering all information as many people are doing on TV.
Therein lies the real tale of this attack. Remember that Pakistan is on IMF dole now, and oddly enough, the political wing of the ISI was dismantled just before the IMF money came through.
I am pretty sure that the Pakistani government now wants the ISI to reign in the extremists, and the agency itself is seeing the light, as inflation is raging at 25% and there is no money to buy oil, while the extremists are setting of bombs as they please. Pakistan is on the brink of civil war, the IMF handout is what is keeping it going. It is in the interest of ISI now to stick to the government line, otherwise they will cease to exist. They are of course hoping to restart their games as things settle, but that is not gonna happen anytime soon, if at all.
Without ISI patronage, the extremists are out on a limb, and they are going to run amok before the eventual crash they can see coming. This attack is the beginning of the amok phase, it has desperation written all over it. Note that the attack came while the Pakistani foreign minister is visiting India.
As I said before, it is the beginning of the end, always the worst phase.
My personal opinion that Hemant Karkare was coerced into going into battle himself by the media when they started hounding him for the failure of his ATS in front of live cameras. A senior officer of his status does not belong in the firing line, the bright lights did him in.
Rahul & Surya – you may have better results with Vinu’s tweets – http://twitter.com/vinu or his Flickr page – http://www.flickr.com/photos/vinu
Correction:
They were among the first, not the first…
Madam President Pratibha Patil is in South East Asia on an official tour despite the attacks!
I particularly miss Peter Jennings. I missed him all year, with the election coverage. Boy, was he good at what he did!
Interestingly, Jennings was from Canada, which currently has the best news anchor in North America (IMO): Peter Mansbridge.
Be thankful for small mercies. Her presence is as desirable as an undesirable thing in a sensitive situation. Had she been on the scene she would have started spouting her personal brand of crap about dead hostages talking to her.
212 · thetrickisimple said
Stop making fun of BUrkha Dutt
215 · Red said
Yet they were also very discriminate about who they killed, and in some instances who they did not kill. They sacrificed their lives to that end. But your point stands. We all suffer and this is an opportunity to underscore that fact. Many people are hoping to therefor hear unconditional condemnation of this act from the moderate majority of Muslims and Muslim figureheads (Imams, leaders, muslim student associations) around the world.
Now India faces ‘Hindu’ terror along with terror of some disaffected muslim youth. More young people are feeling insecure and stereotyped. New Life churches are being burnt, Bangladeshi migrants are being brutally attacked. When will all this madness end ?
226 · Topcat said
She is clearly very offensive and a most unpleasant interviewer. Her appearance is haggard and besides her voice is cracked as of right now, which definitely does not make for good TV. And her most frequent contributors are personalities like Mahesh Bhatt and Shobha De.
215 · Red said
Not really. Their intention was to kill non muslims. Any muslim killed or hurt was unintentional.
227 · Siut said
Yes, I hope the names of the dead gives the hotheads pause. This is not unlike the AQ African embassy bombings, lot’s of African Muslims were killed too.
230 · Topcat said
WOW! I didn’t realize somebody who knew the deepest details of the terrorist org would comment on Sepia! Burkha Dutt would KILL for a get like this.
232 · Rahul said
Well, you dont think they were looking to kill muslims in the Jewish house, do you?
ROTFL!
You should join Jon Stewart!
Um… this wasn’t some “disaffected muslim youth.” An attack like this takes a lot of organization and support to be carried out, hence the possibility that it was masterminded by the ISI. And why would they feel insecure and stereotyped when they were coming from Pakistan, where, last I checked, over 95% (maybe even more) of the population is Muslim? Even so, the growing up blues are no excuse for this kind of attack on civilians.
God, I can’t believe that you’re actually trying to make us feel sympathetic for the terrorists. You sicken me.
233 · Topcat said
And here, silly me, I have no idea why I was thinking about irrelevant locations like CST, Taj, Oberoi, Cama, Metro theater, Cafe Leopold, the petrol pump where, clearly, no terrorist attacks happened. Silly, silly me.
I don’t know how anybody can blame muslims here or give this a religious colour anymore. They have absolutely no rationale to do this after the Malegaon holocast of 7 muslims who died by blast conducted by Sadhvi. Terrorism has no religion. Please be united. We shall rise again as India has always more united than ever.
My two cents – The terrorist (if linked to Al-Q,Pak) were either taking revenge for similar incursions into Pak territories and the recent Syrian incursions by CIA/Special forces or (if linked to local muslim terrorists) were just copying that tactic.
231 · louiecypher said
But unfortunately there was almost no condemnation after the embassy bombings.
Many people question the existence of the “moderate” Muslim, much less that the majority of Muslims are moderate. So this is the moderate’ big chance. Let’s hear condemnation from the Gulf states. Or in the UK, for instance, Muslim Student Associations are largely desi. It should be expected that, in solidarity with their fellow desis in the motherlands, we hear loud and vocal unconditional condemnation from them. A moderate voice here and there will not do. Imams across India and Pakistan and the USA, among other places, moderates at mosques around the world, should condemn without qualifications these cowardly Jihadist terrorists who perpetrated these Mumbai attacks on innocent people of stripes and colors. A failure to do so will surely be heard as complicity.
God, I can’t believe that you’re actually trying to make us feel sympathetic for the terrorists. You sicken me.
This kind of incendiary situation is rife for the birth of a fascist state. When passions run high people are willing to compromise on personal freedoms. That is what the fascists want. And India has a far more real threat from Hindu extremism than muslim extremism when it comes to sheer weight and scope, including political clout. And about the sympathies – yes I do feel sad that a young looking terrorist boy had to be killed by the NSG. There is just no justification for murder, under any circumstances, any whatsoever. Just like Capital punishment. If Gandhi were alive he would have wanted the young boy spared. Unfortunately today’s India is veering towards right wing fascism to the extent that the PM threatens retaliation against neighbouring countries. What a shame. You sicken me!
236 · Rahul said
Guess, you are silly afterall
Taj was such a beautiful building. They should build it again. Oberoi on the other hand can be taken down and a better looking building can come up. (Recovery process)
Can we please please cut off kayastha_lady on this thread?
My two cents continued –
Note Syria-US relations are detiorating not only in the context of Iraq but alos in relations to Israel/Lebanon. And don’t forget the recent Israel raid on the Syrian nuclear reactors. May explain why the Jewish center was attacked.
That is true. But you should understand that Indians have become pragmatic unlike Gandhi. You call that fascist. We call that pragmatic.
For those of you who want to see Jack Bauer like (of 24 fame) counter terrorist action, I don’t think it works that way. Actually I’m a bit disappointed too. I’m waiting to read the details of the operations carried out by the CTU folks (in 24 terms).
I support this. If such protests can be organised when some guy sitting in the Arctic draws a cartoon, such protests can, and should, surely be organised when hundreds of innocent people are killed in the name of Islam. Killing innocents in the name of your religion should hurt more than some moron’s cartoon.
If such protests doesn’t happen this time, don’t complain about stereotyping.
I think they were going by what Bin Laden said about killing Muslim civilians along with non-Muslims during the execution of a terrorist mission
These guys weren’t suicide bombers; there is no conclusive evidence that, even though they were part of an Islamic terrorist group, they did this for religious reasons. It seems more politically motivated.
Let’s not get carried away with calls for condemnation or whatever. Although I was particularly disgusted with this statement from the Muslim Consultative Network in NYC:
[quote]Understood correctly, Islam teaches that the use of terrorism is unacceptable for any purpose. Therefore we at MCN wish to extend heartfelt condolences to the families of the victims and the peoples of India at this tragic time. Peace and Justice will never be implemented through such cowardly actions against civilians. Regardless of background or affiliation, those truly responsible for brutal and immoral attacks should be brought to justice through swift application of the law.[/quote]
You hear that? They don’t even condemn the attack, they only offer sympathy ONLY BECAUSE Islam says that terrorism is unacceptable. Not because it’s sickening on a simply human level. And then they talk about “peace and justice,” as if that was the reason for these attacks. This really disturbed me. (Found at SAJAForum)
That is true. But you should understand that Indians have become pragmatic unlike Gandhi. You call that fascist. We call that pragmatic.
You may be right but Gandhi would surely have been disappointed by the garish show of force for consumption by news media. Commandos swooping in from IAF choppers were not needed to be shown on cameras. Neither were commandos describing in gory details the taking apart of the militants. All this appeals to the violent side of people. There are millions of Indians watching these news reports who are scared and mentally vulnerable. There should have been more statesmanlike conduct and Hindu-Muslim unity on display. Secular even minded people like Ramchandra Guha, Mahesh Bhatt and Teesta Setalwad should have got more airtime than demagogues like Narendra Modi. We have messed everything up and will reap a harvest of hate for this. God bless my India. Everything is going wrong.
This is a great tragedy and we hope it never has to be experienced by anyone again. Let us hope that this awful disaster movie ends and real healing can begin.
237 · kayastha_lady said
LOOOOOLLLL!! you should call yourself ridiculous lady.