Most of our readers don’t know this but Sepia Mutiny was founded and is run on many of the same principles that Sun Tzu laid out in his classic text, The Art of War. Here are some quotes taken from the walls of our blogging headquarters in North Dakota as an example of what I mean:
–All blogging is based on deception. Hence, when able to blog, we must seem unable; when writing a post, we must seem inactive; when we are near, we must make the readers believe we are far away; when far away, we must make them believe we are near. Hold out baits to entice the reader. Feign disorder, and crush them.
–Bring blogging material with you from home, but forage on the commenters… use the conquered commenter to augment one’s own strength.
–The clever blogger imposes his will on the commenter, but does not allow the commenter’s will to be imposed on him. [Link]
Many businesses also adopt Sun Tzu’s teachings which have become part of the fabric of corporate America. An article on our News tab recently informed us that things may soon begin to change. There is a new book of strategy being adopted by prominent business leaders. Business Week reports:
The ancient spiritual wisdom of the Bhagavad Gita seems at first like an odd choice for guiding today’s numbers-driven managers. Also known as Song of the Divine One, the work relates a conversation between the supreme deity Krishna and Arjuna, a warrior prince struggling with a moral crisis before a crucial battle. One key message is that enlightened leaders should master any impulses or emotions that cloud sound judgment. Good leaders are selfless, take initiative, and focus on their duty rather than obsessing over outcomes or financial gain. “The key point,” says Ram Charan, a coach to CEOs such as General Electric Co.’s (GE ) Jeffrey R. Immelt, “is to put purpose before self. This is absolutely applicable to corporate leadership today…”
There are also parallels between Indian philosophy and contemporary marketing theory, which has shifted away from manipulating consumers to collaborating with them. “Marketing has tended to use the language of conquest,” says Kellogg professor Mohanbir S. Sawhney, a Sikh who discusses the relevance of the Bhagavad Gita to business on his Web site. Now the focus is on using customer input to dream up new products, Sawhney says, which “requires a symbiotic relationship with those around us.” [Link]
Interesting idea. I am not sure if the teachings of the Bhagavad Gita would help make SM a leaner and more productive outfit, but in the endless pursuit of perfection I decided to try out some ideas:
Those who consciousness is unified abandon all attachment to the results of their blog posts and attain supreme peace. But those whose desires are fragmented, who are selfishly attached to the comments generated by their work, are bound to the blog by every post they write.
I look upon all commenters equally; none are less dear to me and none more dear. But those who worship me with love live in me, and I come to blog for them.
O sinless Arjuna, I have already explained that there are two classes of men who realize the Self. Some are inclined to understand Him by empirical, philosophical speculation, and others are inclined to know Him by blogging. [Link]
Business Week has more:
Indian thinkers are affecting not only the way managers run companies. They are also furthering their search for personal fulfillment. Northwestern’s Kellogg even offers an executive education leadership course by Deepak Chopra, the controversial self-help guru and spiritual healer to the stars. Chopra also is on the board of clothing retailer Men’s Wearhouse Inc. and has conducted programs for Deloitte, Harvard Business School, and the World Bank.
In a stark, brightly lit classroom, Chopra, sporting glasses with heavy black frames studded with rhinestones, led a class through a 20-minute meditation in June. “Sit comfortably in your chair with your feet planted on the ground,” Chopra instructed the 35 mostly midlevel executives from corporations that are as far afield as ABN Amro Bank (ABN ) and sporting goods retailer Cabela’s Inc. (CAB ) “Our mantra today is: I am.’ “… [Link]
I think that one segment of the market that could really use the guidance and direction of the Gita is the call center industry. Another article on our News tab pointed to the fact that call centers in India are fast becoming dens of lasciviousness:
Stories have been emerging for some time of promiscuity in the 24-hour centres. There was the call centre where the drains were choked with condoms. And the woman worker who told the press that she and her colleagues went to work with condoms in their bags.
Hardly a cause for concern by Western standards. But in India, where attitudes to sex remain highly conservative, it has caused a minor scandal. Which is where the Catholic Church has come in, offering counselling and week-long retreats for call-centre workers “in the hope of turning staff away from a life of sin”.
“We don’t want to do moral policing,” the Archbishop of Bangalore, Bernard Moras, said. “But we want to advise young people that being ‘modern’ doesn’t mean losing family traditions or moral values…” [Link]
<
p>If these lewd young people adopted the Gita to their work environment then they’d know that living in the mode of passion is just plain wrong.
There is a sexual revolution going on in India. The young, at least those from the middle classes, date in a way their parents could never have dreamt of. In the big cities, more and more nightclubs and bars are opening up where men and women can socialise freely.
In Delhi this year, plastic surgeons say they have seen a 40 per cent rise in demand for cosmetic surgery in the months leading up to this weekend’s Diwali festival – with men as well as women seeking nose jobs. [Link]
What the hell?? How did nose-jobs get associated with Diwali? The Kali Yuga is definitely at hand.
Maaf karna bhai taklu aka abhi
do not be bad mothing my honies from Delhi
Um, let me point out yet another business magazine. . .Not to be self-promoting or anything. 😉
Okay, most of that is uterly baffling to me, but as someone who does read the Gita a lot, I will say that “be dutifully detached,” and “do your duty without attachment to the fruits of your actions,” pretty portable advice, and probably what I have felt the most free to share with others (often helpfully so) when they ask for advice.
Interesting idea, “uncompromisingly ethical business practices” based on the Gita, — ie. doing the right thing within the firm and for the clients (if applicable) even to one’s own detriment. It would definitely place a different spin on internal office politics, and even more so in business negotiations with clients, competition with rival firms etc. Of course, some companies do all this already (theoretically), to varying degrees anyway.
With regards to Sun-Tzu, I think he makes a hell of a lot of excellent points and is very accurate in many areas, although personally I have some reservations about the morality of some of his recommendations. But it’s fascinating reading nevertheless.
Anybody read Machiavelli’s The Prince ? Any thoughts ? I haven’t read it myself, although I have no doubt that many of the principles within its contents are applicable to today’s business world (and are practiced by the more ruthless corporate types).
I’d also be interested to hear opinions from people who’ve read Robert Greene’s The 33 Strategies of War. GujuDude, I know you’re out there somewhere 🙂
CAN NOT WAIT for my trip to Bombay in February for 2 weeks. Manish, hook a brother up!
Sorry, MUMBAI.
I know the two of you haven’t met. But Abhi, have you somehow developed a kindred connection with my dad? I swear you were channeling him in his post. The man reads the Gita every morning and sees references to the Gita in anything and everything. Much as our friend Ennis sees brown people, my dad sees the Gita.
Sriram…
I think it’s a parental unit thing…taking excerpts from the Gita etc and using them to define modern day issues. My mom does the same thing your dad does…she sees the Gita in everything in the world.
Why is it a parental thing? Isn’t it a Gita thing? I mean, if you got all interested in the Gita, wouldn’t you be seeing occasions to quote it all the time, regardless of whether you have kids? Heck, Forget the Gita, I see occasions to quote even The Big Lebowski everywhere and have to restrain myself on SM.
The following are conflict theory books, which I believe cover most ground (and overlap, with their own nuances). If there are other books, I’d be glad to hear recommendations:
Older texts Art of War – Sun Tzu Book of Five Rings – Musahashi The Prince – Machiavelli
More modern ones Boyd: The fighter pilot who changed the art of warfare – Robert Coram (and other books on Boyd, OODA loop…) 48 Laws of Power – Robert Greene Art of Seduction -Robert Greene 33 Strategies of war – Robert Greene. * Robert Greene has more books coming out, essentially he sees himself as a modern strategist and all books published will form a ‘canon’ of texts that covers stuff all the older texts, modern examples, etc.
The way I see it, most of these texts are amoral/apolitical. It all depends on what your goals are. You can be someone ‘good’, yet arm yourself with tools and strategies theorized here, or have sinister thoughts and vision, and use similar tools.
The fundamentals preached in all the books follow common thoughts. These aren’t recipe cook books. They simply make you aware of what others may be doing and what you may be doing (intuitively). At the end of the day there is no single formula, just a flowing dynamic where your own common sense and intelligence rests at the center of it.
Bruce Lee’s water quote captures the essense of a flowing dynamic very well.
Correction
Book of Five Rings – Miyamoto Musashi
To some extent this is true, to a large extent it is not. Actually, the metro people are just becoming more open about what they are doing, rather than doing and hiding it, which is the traditional way – parampara, pratishta!
Von Clausewitz’s and Jomini’s works are worth a read, too.
As usual, wikipedia has everything and anything. A list of military theorists and writers.
You forgot Arthashastra by Kautilya
Ahhhhhhhhhhh….. Chanakya Pundit with his three things that can be beaten theory.
Guess what those three are?
Gujudude:
I don’t know of too many people who’ve read Musashi. Good stuff.
Robert Greene and Machiavelli have a lot in common. Neither attempt to put an ethical / moral dimension in their works; both explore “how to get what you want,” in terms of political (and with Greene, also social and sexual tactics). I think that’s kind of interesting, because while most self-help books also seem to refrain from exploring ethics or morality seriously, but get very saccharine in the process (a la “Don’t Sweat the Small Stuff”).
You can’t really accuse most of the ancient works of that, though:
“All warfare is based on deception. Hence, when able to attack, we must seem unable; when using our forces, we must seem inactive; when we are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away; when far away, we must make him believe we are near. Hold out baits to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and crush him.” -Sun Tzu
Yeah, clearly he’s not too worried about the morality behind the actions.
It does seem as though there’s a gap here. It is possible to fight, date, socialize, negotiate, etc. successfully without being amoral or unethical. I have yet to see a work that describes how to behave ruthlessly at a tactical level, but ethically and compassionately at a strategic level.
OK, I’ll bite. What?
Problem with the whole morality thing is that, depending on the time, age, place, morality and ethics are all over the place. The substrate of “be nice, don’t cheat, don’t murder, etc” is common among most cultures. But the tactics and nuances defined within each subset culture can be polar opposites.
These writers don’t dive into the little stuff because tactics are specific. One needs to know what conditions you’re exactly dealing with to precribe the tactic to deploy/counter it. Robert Greene’s books have far more detail, citing examples of tactics (rutheless or not), but he uses them to stress the strategy more (atleast the way I understood it).
It would take a very, very talented and smart person to bridge the strategic and tactial gap. If you’re motivated, reading through other military authors, you’d get a good feel of whatever fills that void. But yea, no single text is out there bridging that gap (lots of permutations to consider in ‘building’ up the pyramid from tactics to strategy).
The longevity of these texts probably has to do with the fact that they float above the moral/ethical plateau. Succesive generations simply adapt the ideas to their times.
Ask an activist. Hint: Replace deception with truth. If you can connect the dots, you might be invited to the secret sepia school, where mutineers are trained.
I wouldn’t beat a dog, they bite 🙂
Would you believe that crappy saying gets qouted to this day in ISKCON, a pre-dominantly western peopled branch of Vaishnavism?
It’s funny. Those people tend to take the worst things of desi culture and attempt to adapt them to a western culture which had already outgrown those dysfunctional ideas due to decades of feminism. I mean, if one is going to adopt anything from any culture, why not adopt the best? Why the worst?
And I say this going both ways. Or any which way.
Incidentally, the Book of Five rings is available here. THough I suggest, you see the three films (Samurai 1, 2 and 3) first. Machiavelli’s Prince is available here. The Art of War is here.
Quizman:
Thanks for the links…
Abhi, your quotation is from the ISKCON
bibleGita. The point of view taken in that book seems more Christian than mainstream Hindu.It’s the point of view of Gaudiya Vaishnavas in general, which is that Krishna is the Supreme Deity, Devadi Deva, Param Ishwar, God of Gods, Lord of Lords.
Even though it is fiction and the main characters aren’t all that savory, the Godfather by Mario Puzo has got some interesting tidbits of wisdom in it.
My boss once brought up an example to our team of where Sonny disagreed with his father (the Don) in front of Solazo (spelling?). This showed the newcomer an avenue to possibly do more business. Killing off the Godfather then making peace (after a fight) with Sonny would secure his business interests.
Essentially, when negotiating, the team ALWAYS needs to show a united front. Disagreements may exist, but they need to be hashed out before you enter the negotiating room with the opposing party. Any sign of weakness or division will always be exploited. As basic as this seems, it is probably one of the most common mistakes made.
I’m afraid, Kurma, that I too have to pipe up and disagree when you characterize Bhagavad Gita As It Is as a bible/Christian. The translation sets the standard for my sect. I’m not going to repeat things ad naueum, I just don’t want the message to get lost b/c of the messenger. . .
Anyway, back to the topic, I was thinking about this this morning, and I think most of the books that I find most influential on working life are indirect, not prescriptive. So, like, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance or Snow Falling on Cedars—I appreciated the notion of quality illustrated in the former, and the sense of digging into one’s physical labor in the latter. I similarly tend to find biographies more inspirational than how-to manuals.
I don’t think it was Kautilya who said that. My money is on Tulsidas. I think he said was
Let me put it into context also, Tulsidas had a very bad marriage. Initially he was obsessed with his wife,then things got detoriated and the lady left him. That might have got his creative juices flowing in this direction 😉
Also, whats a statement which can not be twisted by spin doctors to mean either ways. A lot of apologists later said that by “tadan” he meant “to understand” (the word can loosely mean the same thing) and not “to beat”.
“Tadan” could have meant “to understand?” What is there to understand about a dhol? But the word “adhikari” does not validate the concept of beating either. Adhikari connotes entitlement rather than just plain “deserving” to me, unless it did in those times.
On the business front, the Gita is far more applicable and appropriate to modern business theory than the Art of War. No sane business leader thinks of business as anything resembling war, regardless of the occasional battle cries heard in sales meetings around the world. Adding value, meeting customer expectations, finding a niche, positioning yourself in a market that includes worthy competitors are the goals pursued by business people. Ironically, the Gita originated on a battlefield but it is not about battling anything.
There was an interesting post by Sunil Laxman (Balancing Life) over a year ago on Chanakya. Reviewing Roger Boesch’s The First Great Politcal Realist… Sunil writes, “…if this were to be a canine world, Machiavelli would be a friendly Labrador puppy compared to Kautilya the fierce Rottweiler.”
Arun Gupta in the comments brought some much needed perspective. Guru led management is only slightly better than using Linda Goodman or your friendly astrologer. The only reliable rules are, if you have begun to understand your competitor’s strategy they are now well past it; and no strategy works for all time. Kautilya, Machiavelli etc is serious stuff, meant for running vast empires. The Gita is well beyond that too. Let’s not trivialise either corporate management or the classics.
Gujudude:
yeah, absolutely right. Morality and ethics aren’t even common between cultures, let alone between time periods. I guess that wouldn’t make much sense.
I’m always struck by how ultimately pragmatic all those texts are. All of them are written with a sort of, “look, you may not like this, but it works” attitude. And I think most of the resistance from people who read them, even now, comes from this odd discomfort with that level of ruthlessness. Brownz and Americans alike tend to find that imposing one’s will upon another to be…well, rude.
Which it is, most definitely.
But frequently, it’s also necessary.
Interesting stuff. Anyone got any further reading recommendations?
TOI-letries stole another article. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/132248.cms Times News Network a big plagirist.
Salil:
I agree that these texts are a pragmatists wet dream. Surviving in a world, which only recently, was dominated by a top down alpha-beta order meant good people had to make pragmatic/practical choices, though in view of our modern day ideals, may seem a bit ruthless.
Arming oneself with an awareness of what other may do helps said person with a grounded set of morals to navigate a world that doesn’t play nice all the time. Just because you play by a certain set of gentlemanly rules does not mean the other guy will do the same. This isn’t (to me) atleast about imposing your will on someone as much as paddling your way through rapids, each twist and turn posing a unique set of problems/circumstances.
Sure, maniacs who intutively figure this stuff out will use it to push themselves to the top. Armed with similar knowledge, those who see such a person as a threat to their society/group can counter them. Ying-Yang, brother.
i dont know whether it is from raamcharitmaanas or his other work ..but if it is really from one of his work ..then it can be explained as below :
there are not five nouns here (dhol ,gawaar ,shudra, pasu ,naari ) but only three nouns with two adjectives (dhol ,gawaar-shudra ,pasu -naari ). so they should be beaten.
pasu-naari is like nar-pasu . and gawaar-shudra is self explaining .
i dont think that he had a very bad marriage . Tulsidaas’s wife ratanawali was very beautiful and he was very much attached to her .he never allowed her to go even to meet her family members .so one day when he was not at home ,she went away to see her mother. when tulsidaas heard this he immediately went away to see her even though it was raining heavily .when Ratanawali saw this she said :
” asthi charamama deh taame jaise preeti , jo hoti shri raam maya hoti na yeh bhavbhuti “
(i forget few words here)
meaning :if you had so much attachment to shri ram ,you would have been liberated .
listening to this he went away and started tapasaya . after some time he wrote shri raamcharitmaanas.
GujuDude,
Thank you very much for posts #10, 11 & 13. Some superb reading material there.
One of my best friends is really into Musashi too; I’ve often got into friendly arguments with him about what I regard as the more dubious aspects of the Musashi’s personality and teachings. My friend is a huge advocate of Japanese and Chinese warfare philosophies anyway; in some ways he’s practically a Hindu Punjabi Samurai 🙂
I’m enjoying reading your ongoing discussion with Salil about “ethical warfare” and agree with many of your points, especially the fact that a knowledge of some of the more dubious principles helps you recognise when other parties are using these tactics and thereby enables you to figure out ways to counteract them (even though you may not believe in using these methods yourself).
Salil Maniktahla & GujuDude,
That was my main concern, as mentioned in my previous post. Especially as I believe that the means are at least as important as the ends, and that the latter do not justify the former. (I guess this is particularly pertinent when you consider what’s currently happening in the world, on both sides of the conflict).
Mr Kobayashi also made a brilliant point a few days ago on another thread about how (paraphrasing) “when fighting the monster, we shouldn’t become the monster ourselves”. Very good advice, I think.
I don’t know if “ruthlessly” would be the best word to describe it — “effective” may be more appropriate — but the best historical example that I personally know of would be Guru Gobind Singh. He lost only 2 battles out of total of 14 major large-scale, open-combat battles against extremely well-trained, heavily-armed professional soldiers financed and supported by what was then one of the world’s biggest superpowers; his own troops had originally consisted predominantly of “ordinary people” (“civilians” would be closest description), and he was extremely ethical in his own approach to warfare:
Inspiring one’s troops by positive incentives and by serving as a positive role model oneself. Violence only allowed as an absolute last resort when all other legitimate non-violent methods had failed, and even then only for self-defence or to defend weaker/vulnerable third-parties who had been unjustifiably attacked. Morally-speaking, the means are as important as the ends. No tolerance for collateral damage, no attacks on civilians, no torture of prisoners, no hostages. Only “proportional” force used – ie. the minimum force necessary in order to achieve the objective. No attacks on soldiers who were unarmed, retreating or surrendering, no assassinations permitted. He even advocated the medical treatment of the wounded on both sides without differentiation, even if there was a risk of the enemy soldiers recovering and subsequently attacking his forces yet again.
Leaving aside the religious connotations (which I wouldn’t expect non-Sikhs to be concerned with anyway), I regard him as a superb example of demonstrating ideal leadership and someone who really did incorporate “winning hearts and minds” into his approach to warfare and his conduct in life in general. He’s an outstanding role model; there are so many lessons which would be invaluable in the current “War on Terror”.
I do recall someone on Sikhnet once mentioning a book which had been written on the subject, summarising and analysing the Guru’s military strategies, but unfortunately I’m afraid I can’t remember the name of the book or its author.
Jai Singh,
Good leadership breeds decent strategy and tactics, abusive leadership breeds abusive strategy and tactics.
Wikipedia to the rescue again, it has a summary of 33 Strategies of War. It has a short blurb on passive-aggressive tactics. Gandhi is mentioned.
As a strategy, Indians (for long term gain) saw fighting the British Empire via violence wouldn’t really accomplish anything. It has to do a lot with educated leadership. There was no cohesive force to fight off the British funded Indian Army, civil service, and local kings who surived in cooperating with the British (Baroda’s Gaekwads are one such example) and a violent insurgency would only fracture the region, even if the Brits left. Gandhi/Congress strategy used a passive aggressive approach the left the british scratching their heads while simultaneously uniting the subcontient.
Under somewhat gentlemanly circumstances, the British did not have a strategy to counteract Gandhi. Killing him early, before he solidified his position as the leader, may have had an impact. Brits were too late in recongizing the guy’s abilities, by then it was too late. Gandhi was untouchable. He spoke the common man’s language and the British’s. He intuitively understood what tactic to use and when, under the guiding strategy of non-violence and ulitmate goal of Indian indpendence (and taking all the benefits the Brits were willing to give).
I dont think they ever recognized it … Churchill had no respect for Gandhi!
Of course they did. Not liking Gandhi has nothing to do with whether they recognized him as THE leader of an independece movement. Gandhi’s physical appearance and mannerisms played the passive part to his inner stregth and aggressive non-violence and social campaigns. It doesn’t mean it was an act. Geniuinely beleiving and having passion for good strategy is imperitave. Ulitmately, if you’re not for real, you’ll be exposed as a fake sooner or later. He lead from the front.
Funny isn’t it that when we talk of instant strategy “out of a can” we don’t think of funny things like Gandhi on Management; or The 10-day Gandhigiri Guide. Well for one thing summarising Gandhi is not easy; his collected works run into 60,000 pages! It is far beyond the grasp of any dime a dozen consultant 2ndly it is about his experience not someone else’s.
Jai, just as many of Guru Gobind Singh’s adversaries never came around to appreciating what an amazing, humane leader he was, I think many of the adversaries in the “War on Terror” today would not come around either, even if Guru Gobind Singh’s approach (as described so well by you) were applied. That doesn’t mean that one shouldn’t stick to the highest ethical standards of course…
The point wasn’t to summarize Gandhi. There are several books on him that do that. The point was to use an example ( among others) to stress a particular strategy. There are thousands of pages written on all famous historical figures from Genghis Khan, Napoleon, or Gandhi. Citing examples from their lives in order to discuss something philosophically isn’t out of the ordinary and it has value. His experience is as valid as what the effect of his actions were on others.
If someone thinks that some of these books are strategy out of a can, well, you’ve missed the boat. There is no recipe, only examples that build into our understanding of a pretty complex world.
GujuDude,
Yes you’re absolutely right about Gandhi. The great man’s approach wouldn’t necessarily have worked against the Mughals or Al-Qaeda, though. But it was the most effective strategy given the circumstances, albeit one which — with all due respect — I personally don’t entirely agree with; amongst other things, I’m not a believer in passive-aggressive tactics, not to the extent Gandhi was anyway. However, Guru Tegh Bahadur’s sacrifice of his own life for the sake of the Kashmiri Brahmins could possibly be construed as a passive-aggressive maneouvre to some degree. Nevertheless, there is frequently more than one effective solution to a problem, and Gandhi ji’s approach was definitely one of the “right” answers.
Thank you so much for this — I had no idea all this was on Wikipedia too ! Quite a lot of fascinating reading material for me to plough through.
Wikipedia also has a huge amount of information on the American Civil War; I downloaded about 100 pages worth of info into a Word document a few months ago and I still have to read through most of it. It’s quite heavy-going in places, but extremely interesting nevertheless. I’d really like to see a film called Gettysburg too; over 4 hours long but apparently very good. Also stars Martin Sheen (amongst others), who I’m a bit of a fan of these days.
There’s a film coming out (I think next year) called 300, about the Battle of Thermopylae (official movie website here). It’s based on graphic novels by the same guy who wrote Sin City, and looks quite exciting. A book called Persian Fire about the Greek-Spartan conflicts (including the aforementioned battle) also looks very interesting; it’s also very “readable”, quite sardonic in places. I’ve flicked through it but haven’t bought it yet. One more to add to my ever-increasing shopping list, I guess 🙂
By the way, a quick addendum to my previous thoughts about Sun Tzu: There were some aspects of his mindset I obviously disagree with, but I don’t think he was necessarily completely ruthless. For example, he advocated against killing enemies who were retreating, or (quoting/paraphrasing) “completely destroying your adversary — simply defeat should be sufficient”; I guess it was due to the dangers of becoming sadistic in such matters, along with being motivated by revenge, anger, etc. Which, interestingly, was also what Guru Gobind Singh taught.
PS. You don’t have to call me Jai Singh — just “Jai” is fine. The full username is only for people I don’t have an extensive (positive) commenting history with or SM participants I don’t like very much 😉
Amitabh,
Agreed, but many did, including the “Commander-in-Chief” Aurangzeb, albeit during the twilight of his life after decades of strife and bloodshed. I’m sure you also know the records of Mughal generals switching sides in the middle of battles upon finally coming face-to-face with the Guru, along with Mughal historians who acknowledged that he was a “living saint” even though technically they were on the “wrong” side.
Much of it was to do with Guru Gobind Singh’s impeccably ethical and humane conduct both on the battlefield and off it. Basically, his actions spoke for themselves, and not only proved the legitimacy of his own saintliness and moral authority, but indirectly undermined the claims of those who were arrayed against him. This is especially relevant when you remember that his opponents claimed a) that God was only on “their side” due to them belonging to the “true faith”, and b) that they therefore claimed divine sanction for their actions.
Given the modern-day parallels regarding OBL’s jihad, one can see the relevance of all this today too. Similarly…..
Yes I agree that many of the modern-day adversaries wouldn’t necessarily come around (and we know Guru Nanak’s recommendation “Do not argue with fools” — sometimes relevant here on SM too !), but that doesn’t mean one shouldn’t “try anyway”. Some of the opponents will gain sufficient clarity, some obviously won’t, but you give it your best shot and keep trying, whilst of course doing what is necessary (within limits) to defend yourself and other third-parties who may be under attack. Plus the second paragraph above is also extremely relevant.
Moreover, if the Western and international forces currently working against Al-Qaeda and its supporters used this approach, we would also not have problems such as huge collateral damage, Guantanamo, extraordinary rendition, Abu-Ghraib, the controversy surrounding the (non)-existence of WMDs, along with a whole bunch of other issues which undermine the West’s moral authority — indeed moral advantage — in this struggle from a global perspective, and a) unwittingly give further ammunition to the extremists’ claims, and b) alienate neutral/moderate Muslims everywhere.
Very true.
Agreed 100%.
Jai, do you have any book recommendations on Guru Gobind Singh? I’d really like to read more up on Sikh history.
I am VERY excited to see this. I saw the teaser trailer a few weeks ago and it was AWESOME. I have the Sin City books thanks to a friend who gifted me the series. Gates of Fire by Stephen Pressfield is a great historical fiction book on the Spartan struggle at Thermopylae. Most NCOs and Officers in the US Military have read this at some point it time (if not required reading among certain units). Books on the history of the Peloppensian war are an interesting study, too.
In regards to the American Civil war,Abraham Lincoln, with minor military exprience (Illinois militia), felt he didn’t know enough about wars when the civil war broke out. He inhaled books on military strategy and war, educating himself better than even some of his generals. For mutineers, there is a civil war link to the Sepoy/Sepia mutiny. The second most popular battle weapon during the American Civil war was the P53-Enfield. The same one that caused uproar in the subcontient for the animal fat grease on cartridges.
I believe in the strategy, but not necessarily its blanket application to all spheres of conflict. It was the right moment and place for such tactics. I don’t think the likes of Hitler or Stalin gave two hoots about such things and ultimately such strategy against them wouldn’t have worked (from a non-violence standpoint).
GujuDude,
I don’t personally know of any books specifically about Guru Gobind Singh although I’m sure they’re around — as I mentioned earlier, a book on the Guru’s military strategies was once discussed on the Sikhnet website, but I can’t remember the name — however, there is a huge amount of information available on the internet, as follows:
AllaboutSikhs (Extensive biography of Guru Gobind Singh, 9 pages long — the “next” button right at the bottom of the first page is easy to miss. Absolutely packed with information).
Sikh-history.com
Sikhs.org (Doesn’t contain a biography of Guru Gobind Singh, but does include excellent summaries of the previous 9 Gurus’ lives).
Sikhiwiki
Sikhnet (check the “Sikh History” tab on the toolbar on the left side).
All of the above also contain extensive information on Sikh history in general, along with the associated major figures.
Thanks for the various links in your own post too 😉 I bet you enjoyed the film Kingdom of Heaven as well, although the recent “director’s cut extended DVD” version is supposed to be far better than the original cinema version.
I freely admit that I really liked Tom Cruise’s The Last Samurai. Obviously a sanitised version of that era and culture (as was Gladiator in relation to the Roman Empire), but still poignant, stirring stuff.
Speaking of Rome, Rubicon is supposed to be quite good and is written by the same author behind “Persian Fire”. Another one for my shopping list.
Theoretical knowledge was valued very highly in the 18th century too, from what I know about the American War of Independence. It was the done thing to read up on such matters as much as possible, and this was apparently regarded as often being good enough to qualify a person as a military leader even if he didn’t actually have much practical experience of warfare.
Jai,
Thanks for the links. Lots of infomration to sort through.
Any ‘historical’ type movie with shields, swords, infantry and cavalry, etc. is always entertaining. They put quite a bit of money into those productions like Kingdom of Heaven, Gladiator, or Braveheart.