Much like the girls on Sex and the City would get together to dish, my girls and I will get together and dish about the dilemmas of Dating while Desi. Yes, girls do talk, far more than we blog about. And Dating while Desi ain’t easy, as the mutiny has informed us on Sepia Destiny Part 1. In these talks, we girls will touch on questions such as, “Do you date desi only or non-desis or anyone but white boys? Do your parents sneak around behind your back with biodata and pictures? Do your parents give out your numbers to guys that call and don’t leave messages – from obscure area codes? Do your parents even know that you date? Where do you find desi guys that haven’t gone back to South Asia to get their bride already?” These questions (and more) are indicative to the plight of the single, 25 yr.+, independent-thinking desi girl and is why I love to find solidarity with my single desi sisters – whether over chai, or virtually by reading my favorite desi gal bloggers ( Rupa, TheBarMaid, Chick Pea, brimful, SP, to name a few).
Saturday night while I was surfing on YouTube alone in the North Dakota bunker, I came across this episode of Desi OC – after watching the video I thought to myself, maybe I’ve been playing the game all wrong…
The Desi OC episode above comes out of production company Raising Desi, and one of the film maker is Los Angeles comedian Tarun Shetty. (You may also recognize the gal pal from Timberlake’s Senorita music video.) All of Tarun’s addictive mini-movies are far more polished than the typical YouTube video, but the thing that struck me about this episode in particular were the rules they had for Dating while Desi. We all know the general “Dating Rules” — Wait three days before calling back, never talk politics or religion on a first date, and never say yes to a guy that asks you out the day of.
But I realize now after watching the video, that there are a whole different set of dating rules set aside for Dating while Desi. Who would have known? I certainly didn’t know the rules changed between dating desi, and dating non-desi. So, to summarize what I have learned so far…
Dating While Desi Rules (For Guys)
- If you get a desi girl’s number – three day rule is out. Call the next day if an ABCD girl. But if a FOB girl, you have to pace out with e-mails and phone calls.
- If she asks you what you do, where your family comes from and stuff, she’s no good. She’s grading you to see if you meets up to her social standards.
Dating While Desi Rules (For Girls)
- Make sure to make the guy chase you a little bit and space things out accordingly.
- Go to the bases three times slower with a desi guy than you would with a non-desi.
- Never tell a desi guy that you are really a doctor (or an engineer, or a lawyer). Instead, lie with a less ‘threatening’ career.
- Don’t date a jobless bum. Or desi doctors.
Maybe if I had known these rules, I could have figured out the desi dating game a lot sooner. Hence, I make an appeal to you, oh mutinous crew. Are there other rules to Dating while Desi that I don’t know about? Is it really harder to date us desi girls? (Not that dating you desi guys are any walks in the park.) Or as Tarun says in the video, “Desi girls are hard, man. Stick to dating goris…”
Let the Sepia Destiny virtual dish begin.
has religion ever been a problem for anyone?
Its on the corner of Shangri La and El Dorado…
hey Chickpea, so the doc dude cares only abt beauty and thus decides to head east for a wedding-thats a bit confusing, because desi women are equally beautiful all over the globe:). guess more than anything else, they go looking for typical Bhartiya Nari, who cooks, cleans, works and keeps mum and has not much opinion of her own. thats the cliched image many have of a desi girl, more specifically the ones who are born and brought up in the east. times are changing are so are the women in east. thats why so many of such matches end up in divorce because the women turn out to be ambitious and vocal ones, much unlike what the guys expect them to be.
C’mon buddy….even Aamir needed the beat in the background!
Here:
Well there it is folks — the 100% foolproof method of blowing a bitch shield into smithereens.
Step 2: Find the cohones to actually execute. Hehe.
PS so you do watch some Bollyood milli 😉
Yeah , Utopia is where its at.. stick to the Home depot there ,its classy..the Lowes is a total meat market…
musical (btw like the name)
i can so make a crass comment.. but i will refrain.. but you get the gist of what i’m getting at..
the less educated, no opinions/interests besides cooking, raising kids, ‘subservient’ attitude, is what most of them (desi docs) wanted.. they (boy docs) already had the education and the bank taken care of.. most of the ones i know brought home gals from bharat with ‘home science’ degrees or no degrees at all..whatever floats their boat i guess.
anyhoot, all works out in the world… as it tends to do.. eventually…
okay.. back to clinic..
What problem? I have no problem with men from other religions. It’s not like I’m trying to date them. 🙂
Religion is a problem for me in the sense that I am religious, yet everyone I meet seems to be agnostic or atheist.
Now stop distracting me people! I’m going to do some real work.
🙂
223 haha, that really true for desis? u still do columns for india abroad? let me be more specific. not dating people of other religions period for whatever reason. having to convert to another religion in order to marry the person. having a problem with the other person’s relious tenets etc. also any opinions on the religiousness of desis in general in the US? I think the muslims are more religious. wonder if taz has had problems. I’m almost surprised this angle hadn’t come up earlier.
So I guess the consensus was already made that Desi men are intimidated by strong women and that’s why there are problems between Indian men and women dating.
Why not have just told us this was the established conclusion right from the start? That way, no discussion and all the Indian guys could just agree and we could all move on
Enimals. all of young are enimals. Vat u r saying…
Oh damn. Actually, one last question …
for those of you commenting on the men who go back to desh and bring back submissive, moldable wives — might I ask from what communities those men are from? I wanted to make a comment about someone’s earlier comment about the “demure Indian girl” stereotype, but lost track of it.
Anyway, I ask because in my community (the -American one, not original one in India), the LAST thing any family wants for their son is a submissive, uneducated wife. A bachelor’s degree is a must, master’s preferred. An unemployed woman is out of the question. Not only must she be degreed, but be upwardly mobile in her profession. And beyond that, she is also expected to be anything but demure! The families I know value women who are extroverted hostesses, open-minded, and who can hold their own with the uncles any day. Frankly, I feel a lot of pressure to be some sort of superwoman if I ever wanted to marry within my community.
JOAT #210:
When I was single, frustrated, and living in DC, I’d go to talks and lectures which interested me to meet people. On the chance that I did meet someone, I’d know that they had some similar interest as me, and if I didn’t meet anyone, at least I got to hear an interesting talk/lecture.
I didn’t end up going on any dates, but I did force myself to introduce myself to some very interesting people who are now very good friends of mine.
MBF here in the OC, am having fun reading the comments going back and forth, married at 22, 11 yrs ago..hubby caught me before I knew any better..(kidding, but only a little..)
So strange because the majority of the single guys I know who are around 30 are all looking for independent woman – women who have their own careers, have lived on their own and can have stimulating conversations with them. They completely wouldn’t be interested in women who would be happy sitting at home and cooking.
Is sepiamutinydating.com close to a reality? Can Abhi and ANNA act as Gods. modern day reincarnations of EROS.
make it happen!
It’s already happened – just take a little initiative 🙂
Sure why not. I’m different, I’ve been different my whole life, I don’t want to spend the rest of it trying to explain that to someone else. Nevermind the sweet closeness that I feel with a man who understands my language and who doesn’t get weirded out customs or rituals or for that matter who doesn’t see me as “different” but as someone “just like him”.
My parents have never said to me “Don’t marry a non hindu” but I know if I stepped too far out they would not be happy. All my life I had friends of all races and religions and my parents never said a word about it and were friendly with them and their families just as well. But if I brought a non hindu/sikh (yeah sardars are accepted in my family) home they would have a major cow over it. I know this for sure.
There you go. It absolutely works. Personally I find that I no longer make the effort to “go out of my way” to meet guys. I do what makes me happy and brings me joy and lo and behold there are the guys. And if there are none I don’t notice because I was doing something that made me happy in the first place. It’s a good rule.
I agree, they don’t want us sitting at home and cooking. However, I still have yet to meet more than 5 or 6 (I’m sure there are a ton out there and I just haven’t met them yet) who are comfortable when a Namooru (aka ‘Desi’ for all you non-Kannada speakers) girl voices an opinion or is outgoing. For some reason, speaking our minds makes us ‘aggressive’ or ‘intimidating’, words that make me cringe every time they are ascribed to independent women.
I think we need a site for men who are looking for opinionated desi women – I bet we could get a good number of signups =)
235 ah thanks for the response. didn’t answer my second question.
Sahej,
I too do not want to believe at all in this stereotype of Indian men being intimidated by strong women. After all these are my fathers, brothers and sons we are talking about!
I am an FOB and have not interacted much with Indian guys who grew up outside India. But, to my horror I found that my outspoken nature is not at all welcome with many Indian guys. (yes, I do know some Indian men who are not like this at all, e.g. my husband) Perhaps it is not being intimidated, but just not being interested in a conversation with a woman. I do not know what the reasons are.
I always had this problem back in gatherings in India too that I would sit in the living room and talk with the men about politics or anything else – I did not have anything to talk to in the kitchen with the women. But this was not encouraged – especially after I grew up – past 16-18 years of age. Even the people who encouraged me to be independent before were uncomfortable that I was not demure and would speak up with my opinions even though I was not directly being addressed. This behaviour was quite subtle and I did not understand what it meant until recently
Amazingly enough, even the very highly educated men and women who are from India and whom I meet here also have teh same attitude. Not only do the men feel uncomfortable, the women do too – I can never belong to one of those ‘women’s circles’ because I talk directly to their husbands/boyfriends.
And if I ever mention this, people assume it must be because I am a bitch! In fact, if anything, my problem is that I am a little constrained in my speech perhaps because of the expectations surrounding me as I grew up.
I guess this is not directly related to ‘intimidation’, but it might be contributing to outspoken women not getting attention from desi men.
Desi men are intimidated by strong women
I have yet a meet a strong women (or man) who identifies herself/ himself as “strong”, be any race. Usually, they radiate strength by deeds rather talk about it. Same with sex. Something to think about.
I have seen Benazir Bhutto and Indira Gandhi in person – They weren’t running around claiming their strength.
Bottom line – if you are Madhuri Dixit/ Aishwaryia Rai/ Zeenat Aman/ Dharmendra/ Imran Khan – you can get away with anything. Else, play with the cards you have. Know yourself in the food chain.
Hare Rama Hare Krishna
No guy on this thread has actually complained about opinionated women, though. This site right here is probably as good as it gets in that regard.
Let me understand this. An uneducated woman from India does not deserve a successful guy from the US?.I am not talking about the guy who marries such to exploit them mentally/physically. One of the guys I knew married from India. Now he is spending his money to educate her here in the US.
When you have a strict set of rules to which you want the other person to fall under, then, there is no love and open mindedness.
🙂 Not as much anymore. I hit the ceiling for “topics” palpable to the IA readers. Besides they operate like a very poorly oiled Indian machine. Not like they were making a dent in my dough but it’s the principle of it. I’m enjoying blogging and ghost writing these days 🙂
So then why aren’t all of you hooking up with each other instead of pointing out the shortcomings of the opposite sex!
having an opinion on a forum where your identity is protected versus the willingness to give that same opinion in a crowd– there is a difference
Suma,
My mom used to talk theology with the men, and in fact she was very assertive about her views. As time went on, she was very respected for her views and took a backseat to no one. If anyone new to our circle came by and was agast, well tough shit for him, he could just look on with his mouth open while he got used to it.
However, I too am an opinionated person. In general, people don’t like opinionated people unless they are speaking opinions that the other person agrees with. Being opinionated is a double-edged sword and there is no doubt about that. I don’t have answers, but I object to these idea that Desi men are especially intimidated. It’s too simplisitic and it assumes far too much about a person’s thoughts.
it.
I don’t think anyone here is talking about their personal strenghts at all. Rather the women seem to be talking about their actions (outspoken, talking to men openly, having an opinion) that are defined as “coming across strong” and hence have a negative connotation in the Indian context.
Mainly because there’s not any mechanism for doing it.
Plus, disagreements are unpleasent, and I wouldn’t presume that someone I was having a disagreement with would jump to then have coffee and conversation. 🙂
Did anyone ever tell these girls that they “come as strong” or was it the justification the girls thought of themselves. Like Sahej pointed out, some of them may not have liked them because of their opinions itself not because of having opinions.
re: parents of ABD boys looking for girls from a south asian motherland
i always took that to mean those parents didn’t think we abd girls were good enough for their precious sons…we lacked qualities that would qualify us as suitable candidates. why?? i couldn’t tell you. i have nothing against non-diasporic south asian girls at all– they are powerful and awesome. however, so are we!!
There are a whole host of reasons why this option is taken up, and in order to know it you would have to talk with the people doing it. Looking on from the outside, you will most likely be projecting assumptions onto the situation
Why would any red blooded male complain? It’s not like women have anything quality to say. You just ignore them. Or tie them barefoot to a stove, get em pregnant, and bring groceries to cook food. Whoever listens to opinions anyway? Even if they actually are saying something. I just see the mouth move. Their voice is probably in the ultrasonic range, nothing a human can pick up.
GujuDude runs. Incoming. Take cover.
A barrage of hair spray, nail polish remover bottles, high heels, pink cellphones inbound. And then the wild haired, fake nail armed, banshees make their charge at you. Once you the screaming tazmanian devils, you know you’re in for it. The horror.
Sahej #241:
It’s pretty easy to make a general statement saying that one tolerates, doesn’t mind, or appreciates opinionated women. It’s another matter entirely how one responds to the following statements, for example, from a woman:
No. Let me finish… I understand that’s what you think, but I think…
One friend of mine recounted a conversation she’s had many times:
Her: (has finished talking about something articulately and passionately) Man: (since he has no other response and really would prefer not to exercise his brain) “You need to chill” or “Okay, relax” Her: “Why? I’m perfectly fine, expressing an opinion doesn’t mean I’m worked up about it” Man: “Yeah, well you came across as pretty aggressive”
As she puts it: Standard fucking response
But, like you pointed out, Sahej, these habits aren’t unique to Desi men.
But vivek, on this thread I feel like no one has said that. To the extent possible I think points of view have been countered and not shut down. Maybe I am mistaken.
I think in general, women’s opinions often suffer through what you say, my point of view is that desi men socialized in america are not very different in terms of how threatened they are by women’s successes
found a personal from craigslist relevant to this topic…it includes the original post from the Desi woman
new york craigslist > manhattan > women seeking men > OK this is what I want… – my poor desi sister last modified: Thu, 12 Oct 02:33 EDT
OK this is what I want… – my poor desi sister – 28
Reply to: pers-219446768@craigslist.org Date: 2006-10-12, 2:33AM EDT
so sad, sister. i call you sister, because as a non ivy grad, you can never be anything more to me. not that i would want a relationship with so shallow a woman as yourself, who thinks love is best expressed in the harsh concretist form of a resume, as opposed to a poem. you seek a man who is secure, but what else but your own insecurities would lead you believe that you must have a man with an ivy league education, so that every time you see his harvard t-shirt or his princeton alum email address, it affirms your worth and infuses your cold heart with a tepid glow that a such a man would look at you with appreciative eyes. would a man with a degree from, say, the university of michigan have a gaze of less value. or cuny. or no education at all. our people invented the caste system and it lives on in our spirits, kept alive by women like you who continually seek to redifine bhramanical status in modern terms.
but perhaps if you carpe diem, and go out into the world with an open mind, heart and eyes, then you will not be relegated to die a miserable spinster, who despite her tennis playing, skiing, and magna cum loudly (in case you missed it the first time) was unable to find love. See in the real world, unlike the ivy league fanstasy land you inhabit, we cannot rely on deux ex machina to solve our poorly wrought stories.
So instead of needlessly translating french phrases into latin, remember there is more to life than thinking and being. there is seeing and feeling also.
may you marry a sanitation worker!
ORIGINAL POST:
IF you are a guy Ivy educated, and into the following: running, biking, hiking, reading kant,traveling locally and abroad, speaks various languages, has awesome music taste (smiths, jeff buckley, the clash, the cure, quiet riot, the rolling stones,heart, etc.)is jewish and wants and indian partner in crime, is sweet, is not insecure and is over 30 write me.
A little about me: super cute, funny, well connected, likes to ski and play tennis, knows the difference between the following phrases: “deus ex machina,” “carpe diem,” “veritas” and “cogito ergo sum.” Send a pic maybe we can meet up and discuss.
Please do not be the following: Psuedo intellectual, pretentious, a non-Ivy grad, not ready for a semi serious relationship, not know the difference between Rick Rubin and Robert Rubin, not like animals especially cats.
this is in or around new york and hindustan
no — it’s NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests
219446768
Sorry, it’s a bit late here, I’m unclear on what you mean by this – no one has said what, and which points of view have been countered?
nice…
No one has responded in this thread in the fashion you suggest in your example conversation. If I have and you can point it out, I would like to know.
Sahej:
I agree. My impression is that men in general tend to be threatened by successful women, and this is in no way restricted to desi dudes. But it plays both ways: how many women would show sincere interest in a man they see as less successful than them?
Psuedo intellectual … check pretentious … check a non-Ivy grad … check not ready for a semi serious relationship .. check not know the difference between Rick Rubin and Robert Rubin … check not like animals especially cats … check
hey, i am all the following yaar!!!
i didn’t see an example of this conversation…on this post, but it is relevant to the topic
Painfully pretentious, reminds me of a modern day Honoria Glossop or Florence Craye…
I didn’t see it on this thread either, at least not in the comments that I read through.
I thought it would be useful to add that one to the growing list of anecdotes on this thread.