Much like the girls on Sex and the City would get together to dish, my girls and I will get together and dish about the dilemmas of Dating while Desi. Yes, girls do talk, far more than we blog about. And Dating while Desi ain’t easy, as the mutiny has informed us on Sepia Destiny Part 1. In these talks, we girls will touch on questions such as, “Do you date desi only or non-desis or anyone but white boys? Do your parents sneak around behind your back with biodata and pictures? Do your parents give out your numbers to guys that call and don’t leave messages – from obscure area codes? Do your parents even know that you date? Where do you find desi guys that haven’t gone back to South Asia to get their bride already?” These questions (and more) are indicative to the plight of the single, 25 yr.+, independent-thinking desi girl and is why I love to find solidarity with my single desi sisters – whether over chai, or virtually by reading my favorite desi gal bloggers ( Rupa, TheBarMaid, Chick Pea, brimful, SP, to name a few).
Saturday night while I was surfing on YouTube alone in the North Dakota bunker, I came across this episode of Desi OC – after watching the video I thought to myself, maybe I’ve been playing the game all wrong…
The Desi OC episode above comes out of production company Raising Desi, and one of the film maker is Los Angeles comedian Tarun Shetty. (You may also recognize the gal pal from Timberlake’s Senorita music video.) All of Tarun’s addictive mini-movies are far more polished than the typical YouTube video, but the thing that struck me about this episode in particular were the rules they had for Dating while Desi. We all know the general “Dating Rules” — Wait three days before calling back, never talk politics or religion on a first date, and never say yes to a guy that asks you out the day of.
But I realize now after watching the video, that there are a whole different set of dating rules set aside for Dating while Desi. Who would have known? I certainly didn’t know the rules changed between dating desi, and dating non-desi. So, to summarize what I have learned so far…
Dating While Desi Rules (For Guys)
- If you get a desi girl’s number – three day rule is out. Call the next day if an ABCD girl. But if a FOB girl, you have to pace out with e-mails and phone calls.
- If she asks you what you do, where your family comes from and stuff, she’s no good. She’s grading you to see if you meets up to her social standards.
Dating While Desi Rules (For Girls)
- Make sure to make the guy chase you a little bit and space things out accordingly.
- Go to the bases three times slower with a desi guy than you would with a non-desi.
- Never tell a desi guy that you are really a doctor (or an engineer, or a lawyer). Instead, lie with a less ‘threatening’ career.
- Don’t date a jobless bum. Or desi doctors.
Maybe if I had known these rules, I could have figured out the desi dating game a lot sooner. Hence, I make an appeal to you, oh mutinous crew. Are there other rules to Dating while Desi that I don’t know about? Is it really harder to date us desi girls? (Not that dating you desi guys are any walks in the park.) Or as Tarun says in the video, “Desi girls are hard, man. Stick to dating goris…”
Let the Sepia Destiny virtual dish begin.
This protocol business is too sophisticated for it’s own good.
Following protocol seems daft when you actually like the other person, and breaking the protocol subjects you, and the other person, to second guessing (what a great way to start.)
I propose that second guessing be abolished (see — it works, the couple in the video would have gotten their coffee.)
No von Mises what my hobbies were (i mean really? do people discuss hobbies anymore? What? Why not? Is it more suave to just “read” potential hobbies as the convo goes along? Am I not reading signals as I should if I ask? Am I uncool? Help.
Yeah i agree talking hobbies can make good conversation but this guy i was referring to expected me to list out a number of things, maybe he was hoping to hear gourmet cooking in the list, instead of doing that i was more interested in discussing the sport. Anyway i think you would have phrased it much better.
Tell me about it. You boys are scary to reject…
HMF- all you gotta do is add those delicious desi babes to your blog reader and you’ll have more than enough proof of dating desi from the women perspective. Rupa’s speed dating blog is the best example “intimidating women” off the top of my head.
So why aren’t you guys together anymore?
The FOB guys rules to dating ABCD chicks.
1.Gel and spike your hair. This is a freakin must.Those spikes should be lethal weapons. 2.No facial hair please. Goatee acceptable but no moustache. 2.Lose the accent.Either go totally American or even better faux Brit south Bombay . 3.Brush up on your Bollywood. ABCD chicks are totally into that shit. Hide your punk rock and hip hop CDs and get into Himesh. 4.Pretend to be really into Indian culture and traditions. 5.Taking a summer course counts as studying at an Ivy league institute. Harvard works best, but don’t go lower than Cornell.
I guess I’ll try to make up for the lost post in small increments 🙂 Unfortunately, it won’t be nearly as articulate as last time!
JoAT said: “And yes non brown men generally don’t come attached with umbilicial cords.”
And neither does this brown girl!! I love my mama, and I dare any desi guy to prove that his umbilical cord is stronger. All jokes aside, I think my relationship with my mom/family is likely the reason that my relationships with desi guys do occur at a much, much slower pace.
I have openly dated non-desi guys in the past, and my parents have generally been supportive. However, the support occurs like this: “OK, go ahead, we won’t throw a fit or make life difficult. You can do it on your own terms and we’ll learn to accept it.” They don’t know the guys very well, they don’t feel that they can talk openly with them, etc. I think they sort of assume the worst is happening if I’m with a white guy, but they definitely have different standards about how things should progress with a desi guy. I haven’t completely adopted those standards, but I think I follow them in order to make life less difficult for all of us down the line. If I were to date a desi guy, the game changes. No longer is there a sort of distant acceptance of the thing. I assume that if I marry a desi guy, he will really become a party of my wonderful family (and I, his). I won’t be off on some island with my white husband who tries but can’t really communicate with my family. I would move slower with a desi guy, for a lot of reasons. One, I wouldn’t want any extreme improprieties to become fodder for any family gossip later on. If I were with a non-desi guy, I’d be automatically off the hook there. Second, I guess I do believe that a marriage ideally is not just between husband and wife but to some extent, between two families. (As I type that, I wonder if I’m crazy and I welcome challenges to that). I see myself taking things slower, really feeling things out with a desi guy, because if things don’t work out, it will not only be a loss to me but also to my family. With a white guy, if it doesn’t work out, I’ll be the sole owner of that loss (or mistake, as it has been).
Having said that, I’ve given it up in equal measure to desi and non-desi guys; just would think twice at this age with someone who has actual relationship potential.
Harvard works best, but don’t go lower than Cornell.
I guess I am in the game.
I am so happy today. You rules have some kernel of truth though.
No, really, does someone actually list some rules a nice ABCD boy needs to follow to date a nice desi girl in NYC? runs and gets notepad
I kind of wish I could take back my previous post, as I really haven’t spent enough time sorting through that stuff. I’ve never really put all of that in writing, so hopefully some of you will help me figure out if I need to rethink things. 🙂
…i.e. no
U PennTufts.This talk of Desi men being intimidated is so off;
Let’s play a game; Woman, good looking, keeps herself fit, plays rec league soccer, has a good career, sings jazz music, speaks 3 languages, has a nice car and a nice place of her own. Has a ivy league education and two of her siblings are professionals, while the other works at a non-profit and spends most of his time overseas.
Ok, you tell me, how many joe schmoe, I work from 9-5, I have a decent sense of humor and I know who Miles Davis is, is going to work up the gumption to holler at this lady?
The way dating usually works, not that I am an expert, in fact an anti-expert is; if you like a dude you in some way make it possible for him to approach you. We are not fooled into knowing we sweep you off your feet. We all know we’re being led to believe we’re making the choice when in reality 90% of the time we’re not in control to the extent we think. If you want to date a Desi guy; be approachable and nice. It will work and you’ll find an even percentage of Desi versus non Desi men will be intimidated.
FOB_playa:
what sort of girl does your list attract? Somehow I have a hard time believe that someone following that list would catch the eye of the girls posting on this thread for even a second.
)
I concur with you.
Not you KT not you! sigh
Lord there are NO rules. Be who you are, don’t lie, don’t be deceptive. No games. If you like her, make it known. Be respectful of who she is. Why would you want to win someone by manipulating her? At some point your true colors will come out won’t they? Then what?
She went to the speed dating thing while she had a boyfriend unless I’m wrong. Who lived in another country for 14 years, speaks another language fluently, and is in Medical School. You think that was a fair assessement of how willing a Desi man would be to date her? I think its unrealistic to expect to find someone you like when you’re iffy in the first place. Really, unless Mr Abhishek Bachcan or something was at this Speed Dating thing, was there anyway a dude was going to have a chance?
I have nothing to add to this discussion, but I did like FOB_playa’s Rule #3:
Play on!
Serious!! getting angry is one thing but when they start crying, madre mia!
It’s so nasty on one hand you just want too run away and hide because bursting out into laughter is rude on the other hand you can’t help but feeling like you have to hug him or something just to make him feel better.
Yep that and being down to earth, in touch with your innernerd and
NO tears..
it’s the worst thing to do to a girl
really
Uh, Friendster and Myspace. Y’all.
This assumption is a BIG mistake. That may be the initial appearance, but going to India because you can get a girl to ‘mold’ is seriously misguided. If a guy is THAT insecure, it doesn’t matter what kind of woman he winds up with, his insecurity will play out to make life not as fruitful as it can be. Sure, a gal from India may adjust in ways a girl from here may not, but assuming that [the guy] won’t have to adjust is absolutely stupid. It will happen and in ways you won’t expect.
India, Africa, USA, UK, whatever. Find someone kind, smart, and complementary. Find a partner. Find a teammate. Two strong and smart individuals (wherever they come from) makes LIFE more fun and manageable.
I’m one of those dudes that has decided to keep ALL options open. India as well as here. India wound up being the place where I found someone with similar vision of future intellecutal and personal growth, and an equal who complements me (as I her). She is smart, witty, and quite independent minded. She told me stories of how guys did come looking for the ‘moldable’ girl and she was disgusted by it.
Do ABD women give enough credit to FOB girls who enter relationships with dudes from the United States? For some reason, it seems people look ‘down’ upon it.
I think some of y’all actually don’t have a good opinion of Desi men but you think you need to be with one, and so you pretend you have this great opinion of Desi guys. In reality, your opinion is not very positive and we simply serve as a scapegoat for other emotions.
ovaltine,
Interesting…Dating Desi Rules I would offer the opposite sex? The post was meant for the rules that existed that i wasn’t prive to, until the past year…So if I may offer you desi men some dating advice….
Ask a girl out on a date. Not, “umm, we should, maybe, like, hang out, like our friends, together.” Grow balls, ask. (I think this is an LA thing though- guys here are ridic anti-committal.) And don’t ask her out the same day – like Friday at 5pm for that night.
Don’t be boring. Be witty, sarcastic, think on your toes.
Be registered to vote. (seriously, this one of the first thing that I ask.)
Read SM/ Be a blogger. (seriously, it’s the second thing I ask.)
Be secure with your identity as a South Asian Am/Brownz. (I have been on dates with desis that aren’t. Those dates have cricket chirping conversations.)
Look me in the eyes when talking to me.
Don’t be in one of those “open relationships.”
Don’t be flakey. Or late.
That must explain all the 30+ divorced dudes who married a chick from India the first time around that I meet.
People should do what makes them happy really. I’ve seen all kinds of relationships work, long distance, interracial, age difference everything. But I think these relationships were successful because the two people in these relationships respected each other and truly cared and loved. And unfortunately I’ve seen the two people who were perfect for each other, had perfect supportive families fall out with each other.
One of my closest friend married a girl from India, both families were very supportive. They both tried to make it work but gave up after a few years. They really just couldn’t get on the same page with each other. In hindsight he feels that there were too many assumptions about how the marriage was supposed to work, that the foundation they needed, getting to know each other’s core values, before marriage was missing.
And frnakly a lot of times a Desi women doesn’t even admit to having a white boyfriend right off the top, so you never are quite sure. And being Indian, since “at some point I want to marry Indian” even though right now I am genuinely in love with someone and don’t see myself without that person…..they pretend as if there is something real there. And when it doesn’t work out? The dude was intimidated. Come on.
This is not about Rupa. I like Rupa’s blog a lot and, I would totally date her or someone like her. However, she’s got a man and I ain’t a catch.
The basic rule of dating, for both men and women, as several people have already stated: Be yourself. If he/she doesn’t respond, two things to tell yourself: 1) this wasn’t the right person for you and 2) now you’ll never have to question, “if only I acted more like myself … maybe she would have liked me.” You have now been rejected because of who you actually are, not because of who you were pretending to be. Take some comfort in that and move on.
I think the problem is that not many people approach a first meeting/dating with hope, patience, or even friendliness. Most of the girls I know are wary (or have a “bitch shield” as someone put it) 10 minutes before they enter a place; most guys I know operate on the assumption that they will have to resort to strange tactics to get on a girl’s good side. It is a catch 22, y’all.
I am notorious for being cold; here’s the half-joking version of how you get to talk to me, in the real world, not the “be nice and be yourself” world — ’cause that doesn’t work when the shield is up.
But whatevs. Rules be damned. Sometimes you just click, innit?
Every male commenter here should just e-mail one of the female commenters and ask her out. Maybe 1/3 of you will go out on a date and get along and then more people will fall in lub and use my site.
Makes sense to me!
These are some massive generalizations about brown men and women.
I’m a brown man – who, until about a year ago, thought he had impossibly high standards – dating a brown woman – who, until about a year ago, thought she had impossibly high standards – and we’re both pretty durned happy.
What’s her man gotta do with you?
Asl
I was literally brown dating (i.e in view of getting married) right, left and centre (what can i say, my mum was very driven :>) and none of them worked out because they would all play games even the interested or interesting ones. it’s all a distant memory now what sort of games, but what i can say about my current partner is that i liked him because he showed enthusiasm from the start, and he called me the very next day. (btw we met at a party and not the going thru the parents way) so I guess from the start there was no pressure to deal with in the first place, but it got the ball rolling. Now after seeing each other for a year plus and now that we are just married that’s what i remember about how it got to this, that he was enthusiastic about us and he called the very next day,i was attracted to that quality and in turn it made me want to explore the possibilities.. So if you meet someone that you have a connection with i say maintain the pace, what do you have to lose..
I think this can be said for a very sizable population of males of every hue and color
milli,
LOL – that was classic. Stick with milli’s rules. 😉
Aw for f*ck’s sake, taz, haven’t you ever heard of Indian Standard Time? 😉 I was with you till that last one.
true, but I think the real issue is that we spend way too much time on a computer talking about asking people out instead of emailing men/women we know to see a concert or grab a bite to eat. But maybe I’m just projecting?
That has to be a joke, right?
I give up. This whole thread is not an attempt to converse, its a blame game
🙂 Milli – those rules are the truth! That would a list very similar to what I had written down a few years back :)) NICE!
LOL. This list is crazy though.A club/ bar is a volume environment. Its a numbers game.Its suicide to plot this much before approaching a girl. By the time you are through jumping through those hoops its closing time and all the ditzy chicks are already cornered. Unless you look like Ash, or enjoy stalkers, a normal guy is unlikely to plan that much especially after being half smashed already.
Milli has been watching way too much bollywood
“Maybe the solution is for both sides to be more forward, and not so judgmental before even talking to someone.”
Until that happens then no, I’m not sure those rules re: first encounters are a joke. And I feel confident in saying that many of my girlfriends think the same way. I think the issue is that those “rules” I outlined pertain to a random encounter at a public event, which in my opinion, is really the last place to meet someone.
My bitch shield primarily goes up in clubs, bars, parties because I don’t go to those places to meet people — I go to hang out with friends, dance, have fun. An awkward approach by a stranger tends to interfere with that. It also goes up because 1) if you tell a guy you’re not interested at a bar, you’re stuck in the same place all evening and 2) in my experience, even after I’ve expressed a firm lack of interest, the guy insists on trying to chat me up or becomes hyper defensive (i.e. “what, you don’t like the way I dance?”). That’s just rude, and I’d rather avoid any sort of encounter like that.
Personal note: I tend be be very extroverted and become near paralyzed when I feel my sense of security is threatened. Clearly I need to work on better ways of interacting with people, but until then, bitch shield it is.
Milli you should post it on your blog and I would fwd it all my friends. Funniest stuff on this thread so far 😉 Rest of the guys give her a break. She said its a half-joking version. And Milli don’t reveal which half is the joke, that would ruin the fun.
Alas, Ritam, I’ve only seen 2 Bollywood movies in my entire life.
Sonia I am with you. Hubby from day one showed interest and he wasn’t afraid to — I admired that. I remember the line he used, after our night of hanging out, he called me the very next day and said, “I sincerely hope I didn’t monopolize your time yesterday.” He returned every phonecall the same day. He returned every email. There were no effing games; therefore, I trusted him.
Side note, nothing pisses me off more than hearing girlfriends bitch b/c their S.O. is so damn busy and important at his job that he can’t make time to chat for a bit. Please.. such b-o-l-o-g-n-a. Even when hubby is working on a deal at 3 am, he makes time to call me or im me for a minute, so I know it can be done. Getting off my soapbox
It might sound bollywood-ish, but those are the rules of engagement when in a club/bar that isnt too loud. If its your intention to get those girls, stay away from loud places. No one wins there.
I think the trick is to do all that without actually showing that you are jumping the hoops! You only entertain, not become a clown.
I think she has a point.
I love this topic!!! I’m only on #127 and I have so much more to read!! Can’t wait to read everyone’s thoughts and add a few of my own…as soon as work is over 🙁
Thanks SM!!!!! ROck on! 🙂
Ha, Before I moved to NYC from San Diego, I always thought Bar/Clubs/Etc where places to meet people. Sadly, and ratherly painfully, this is not true… so where is a good place to meet people in a highly urban area?
Define ‘meet’.
Ok fine Milli.
But what if I grabbed the mic at a club and started singing “koi kahe kehta rahe…”…..would your bitch shield go down at all…..
This sentence should be underlined, bolded, and italicized. I was 24 before I realized that getting dates becomes much easier when you actually ask a woman out. My second suggestion is to avoid all the ridiculous eye contact/look away nonsense. If you see a person, go up to them, stick out your hand, and say, “Hi, my name is X, what is your name?” You’d be amazed how well it works. If you get blown off, it’s really no big loss.
Wouldn’t you do better with Blame it on the Rain, given her handle?
Sriram, I agree that the direct approach works and even if you get rejected, better that you didn’t dance around the subject. BUT, for me, that works after some sort of connection has been established. I honestly don’t want to be approached or asked out solely on the basis of my looks, not at this age.
Ritam, well, your last post made me burst out laughing so yes, I’d say you stand a good chance.
Personally bars and clubs are the worst place to meet people. Guys have their playa shield on and girls have their bitch shield on and no one wins. You come out with the phone number of someone that probably wouldn’t interest you more sober and in bright sunshine. And frankly the only people that come out with a phone number are the really hot chicks. Unless you are super hot, have your tits hiked up around your neck and perky guys aren’t necessarily looking at you. And lets face it average chicks like me aren’t going to score at a bar full of hot chicks.
I have better luck meeting guys in non pick up places….trains, elevators, Art galleries, Movie premieres, Barnes & Noble, Trader Joe’s, Starbucks, Home Depot, Loews etc.
Hahhahahaha. But which song has more of a chance of being played at the club??
Meet – a magical place where bitch shields don’t exist..
Here, here. Can we have a discussion on SM without assuming we’re all super attractive and wildly financially successful? I’m happy and all for all of you and all but still.
If you are going to sing it, why care if the club plays it or not? 😉