Ice cream truck driver 1, Government 0 (updated)

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In a case which I have been following daily for the past week, a Federal judge in Sacramento has declared a mistrial in the “terror” case against a Pakistani American ice cream truck driver. His son’s (accused of attending a terrorist training camp) jury is still deliberating but may also end up hung (see previous posts for backstory 1, 2, 3). This is a huge defeat for the government. CNN reports:

Umer Hayat, 48, and his 23-year-old son were tried at the same time but given separate juries. The son’s jury was still deliberating Tuesday.

The announcement of a mistrial in the father’s case came one day after the jurors told U.S. District Court Judge Garland E. Burrell Jr. they could not reach an unanimous decision after nearly two weeks of deliberations.

“The jury declared that it was hopelessly deadlocked this morning,” deputy court clerk Carol Davis said Tuesday. Burrell questioned each juror and then discharged them…

“They couldn’t prove it because it didn’t happen,” Umer Hayat’s attorney, Johnny Griffin III, said outside court Tuesday. “He’s not a terrorist. There is no evidence to demonstrate he is a terrorist…” [Link]

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p>What makes the government’s loss particularly embarrassing is that jurors were shown a taped confession but STILL didn’t find him guilty. I’ll bet you this case is used as a teaching tool in law schools for years to come. That’s what happens when you try to manipulate someone who doesn’t have mastery over the English language (see my previous post #3 linked above). The manipulation seems like it was evident to the jury but we will have to wait until they are interviewed in the coming days.

The Hayat case centered on videotaped confessions the men gave separately last June to FBI agents and a government informant who secretly recorded hundreds of hours of conversations but whose credibility was challenged by the defense.

Defense lawyers’ biggest hurdle was trying to persuade jurors to discount the men’s videotaped confessions. They argued that the confessions were made under duress, after the men had been questioned for hours in the middle of the night… .

The father and son eventually told the agents merely what they thought they wanted to hear, without realizing the legal consequences, their lawyers argued. [Link]

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p>

The case against the son was considered stronger by the government but the fact that the jury has been out this long is a good sign for him as well.

Update: The jury convicts the son after all.

83 thoughts on “Ice cream truck driver 1, Government 0 (updated)”

  2. This is a defeat for all americans

    Defeat tastes pretty good then. Kind of like ice cream.

  4. This means that the due process is working for citizens, and all the fear-mongering about this administration subverting the Constitution is just hot gas.

    M. Nam

  5. This means that the due process is working for citizens, and all the fear-mongering about this administration subverting the Constitution is just hot gas.

    Oh Please. Go have some ice cream dude.

  6. Well there still hope that the jury in the son case, will do the right thing and make america safe.

  7. I know I am slow without lots of coffee (and ice cream, yum), but I thought the point of the post was that ‘due process’ had been subverted. It’s people in power who don’t know how to use it that make America unsafe. Mocha ice-cream anyone?

  8. This means that the due process is working for citizens, and all the fear-mongering about this administration subverting the Constitution is just hot gas. M. Nam

    Moor Nam the requirement that confessions be voluntary is a CONSTITUTIONAL requirement (came down before Miranda, still counts). What the government ATTEMPTED to do here is subvert the Constitution. It’s not hot gas. This attempted subversion just didn’t work this time. The executive branch is going to push and push to see how far it can go. It’s the judiciary’s job to keep it in check.

    Yes, I’m glad this ended in a mistrial. I don’t think it’s a HUGE blow to the govt., more a mere setback. There is no acquittal, the FBI won’t leave, their lives won’t be the same.

  9. In a similar hotly debated case, former University of South Florida Sami Al-Arian has finally pleaded guilty to aiding Palestinian Islamic Jihad:

    <

    blockquote> Former University of South Florida Professor Sami Al-Arian has pleaded guilty to a charge of conspiring to provide services to the Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), a specially designated terrorist organization, in violation of U.S. law, the Department of Justice announced today.Link

    For the longest time, everyone claimed he was innocent. Looks like the prosecutors in the Lodi case did not construct a better case. I think there are still deportation charges pending against the Lodi duo.

  11. I think there are still deportation charges pending against the Lodi duo.

    Ummm. Vikram, tell me, just how does one bring “deportation charges” against a U.S. citizen? It can’t be easy.

  12. Ummm. Vikram, tell me, just how does one bring “deportation charges” against a U.S. citizen? It can’t be easy.

    If it can be proved that they lied on their citizenship application, it may be grounds for revocation of their citizenship.

  13. Of course, revocation would apply only to the father’s citizenship, as he is a naturalized citizen.

  14. If it can be proved that they lied on their citizenship application, it may be grounds for revocation of their citizenship.

    Wow dude you are really reaching. Keep us up to date on these supposed hearings. Also just because Sami Al-Arian pleaded guilty doesn’t mean he was. Have you been following the Operation Meth Merchant case? Often times people plead guilty because it is better than rotting away in a cell because they have no rights.

  15. If it can be proved that they lied on their citizenship application, it may be grounds for revocation of their citizenship.

    I do believe it is so. Naturalized American citizens are never equal to the “original” – I remember at one of the border posts a couple of years ago, a middle aged brown man being questioned. He had become an american citizen decades ago. But still the officials were like “were you BORN here?” and they did take that distinction into account.

  16. Abhi,

    You can always create conditions (themselves or by Uncle S), when one would ask/ request for renouncing citizenship, like Bobby Fischer.

    Fischer renounced his U.S. citizenship, according to the AFP. The following month, it was reported that Fischer would be marrying Miyoko Watai, the President of the Japanese Chess Association, with whom he has been living since 2000. There has been speculation that he married her in order to aid his chances of being allowed to stay in Japan. He also appealed to United States Secretary of State Colin Powell to help him renounce his citizenship.
  17. Also just because Sami Al-Arian pleaded guilty doesn’t mean he was.

    Right, and I suppose he is exuding warm and fuzzy sentiments in these videos towards America and Jews….

    Here is a case of US citizenship being revoked for a former Nazi:

    U.S. Citizenship Revoked for Former Nazi Tom Perrotta New York Law Journal 02-02-2004 A federal appeals court has revoked the citizenship of an 84-year-old New York resident who admitted he was a member of a Nazi firing squad in Poland that killed Jews during World War II.Link

    I suppose it is possible that he may have pleaded guilty to avoid “rotting away in a cell” too…

  18. This is a defeat for all americans Defeat tastes pretty good then. Kind of like ice cream.

    I’m laughing out loud. Awesome.

    I’m not sure how finding someone guilty or innocent in a court of law translates into a “defeat for all Americans.” I mean, can the hyperbole, dude. It’s getting everywhere.

    Like, uh…melting ice cream?

    Goddammit, now I need a new simile AND I want ice cream.

    And yes, there is a distinction between naturalized citizens and natural-born citizens. I don’t think you can deport a naturalized citizen, though.

    From Wikipedia:

    There is an interesting loophole here in that the Constitution does not mandate race-neutral naturalization. Until 1952, the Naturalization Acts written by Congress still allowed only white persons to become naturalized as citizens (except for two years in the 1870s which the Supreme Court declared to be a mistake)…Passage of the Fourteenth Amendment meant that, in theory, all persons born in the U.S. are citizens regardless of race. However it was not applied to Asians at the time. The enabling legislation for the naturalization aspects of the Fourteenth Amendment was the 1870 Page Act, which allowed naturalization of ‘aliens of African nativity and to persons of African descent,’ but is silent about other races.

  21. Guys I know that citizens can be deported (in rare instances). I was being sarcastic with that particular comment. There are no “deportation hearings” against these men however. Vikram totally made that up and just threw it out there because it was wishful thinking and HE wants these people deported because…well because he is ultra-conservative. There I said it.

  22. The thing that worry’s me about the Lodi father and son duo is there location. My sister lives nearby, so do 5 pairs of aunt/uncles and 12 cousins, of which 11 are married and they have total of 21 kids, and my grandma, that 56 people in my family

    The thought they could be at wrong place at wrong time when these Lodi idiots do something worry me alot.

  23. verdict for the son… guilty

    Here is what they are saying:

    Hamid Hayat, a seasonal farm worker in Lodi, an agricultural town south of Sacramento, was convicted of one count of providing material support to terrorists and three counts of lying to the FBI. [link]

  24. All this talk about ice-cream….mmmmmmmmmmmmmm….. On a related note, my desi granny pronounces ice-cream “ass-cream”. heh heh… as kids, this amused me and my friends to no end. But I digress.

    There is an interesting loophole here in that the Constitution does not mandate race-neutral naturalization.

    This probably STILL unofficially hold, even if it has changed to reflect political correctness. You’re only true blue Amreekan if you’re white… and sometimes black. So, has this passage in the Const’n changed???

  25. PearlJamFan,

    You refuse to tone down your racism, fine. Will you at least consider correcting your grammar? Thank you.

  26. Vikram totally made that up and just threw it out there because it was wishful thinking and HE wants these people deported because…well because he is ultra-conservative. There I said it.

    It is Sami Al Arian who is being deported… I confused his case with the Lodi one. These cases all begin to blur together. No lack of them in the news these days 🙂

    Just curious, would you be on your soap box about somebody charged with being a terrorist and possibly facing loss of American citizenship, but were not South Asian or Muslim? Or is it only cases like the Lodi case that qualify for your sympathy and the notion of the evil government harassing innocent people ?

    You’re only true blue Amreekan if you’re white… and sometimes black.

    I suppose when the US government denies US entry to somebody like this, it must be discriminination too 😉

    Former SI swimsuit model denied U.S. entry MIAMI, Florida (AP) — Former Sports Illustrated swimsuit model May Andersen, accused of hitting a flight attendant on a plane from Amsterdam to Miami, was refused entry into the U.S. on Monday, officials said. Andersen, 23, will be returned to the Netherlands on the next available flight, said U.S. Customs and Border Protection spokesman Zachary Mann.Link

  27. Vikram, Read Salil’s posting. if I understand correctly, he was referring to the fact that sometimes even if you were born here, you still may not have been considered a naturalized citizen! There were certain prerequistes – being white was one of them.

    Thus your response:

    I suppose when the US government denies US entry to somebody like this, it must be discriminination too 😉

    is not applicable, since I was talking about the status of those BORN here… not about entry.

    You should heed Abhi’s advice… and my granny’s.. and get some “ass-cream” 😉

  28. There is an interesting loophole here in that the Constitution does not mandate race-neutral naturalization.
    This probably STILL unofficially hold, even if it has changed to reflect political correctness. You’re only true blue Amreekan if you’re white… and sometimes black.

    (With a caveat .. applies to naturalized only)

    Vikram said:

    I suppose when the US government denies US entry to somebody like this, it must be discriminination too 😉

    Entering a country is totally different and irrelavant to the argument of race based citizenship laws and laws that allow deportation of a naturalized citizen.

    Unfortunate FACT is that US citizenship laws are based on RACE. Its just that the definition (or understanding) of race is changing.

    Since RACE is the basis of citizenship for naturalized citizens, I highlighted the above statement.

    Vikram (just for example, it applies to everyone) may be a born citizen and thus safe from deportation, but probably his parents arent. His conservative credentials will not mean much in a hypothetical situation of his parents being falsely convicted of a trumped up terrorism charge. Only the race will matter.

    PS: This comment isnt personal to Vikram but anyone who’s parents are naturalized citizens.

    Also in no way I am saying that Lodi case is trumped up charges. I dont know enough about it.

    About the Al-Arian case, all I want to know is that was any IRA funders, deported ???? (As majority IRA funding happened from the US)

  29. PS: This comment isnt personal to Vikram but anyone who’s parents are naturalized citizens.

    Gee, thanks for that backhanded disclaimer… much appreciated…

    About the Al-Arian case, all I want to know is that was any IRA funders, deported ???? (As majority IRA funding happened from the US)

    Here you go…knock yourself out:

    For two hundred years the United States has been a safe haven for Irish political prisoners seeking refuge. More recently however the US government has sought deportation, extradition and prosecution to exclude Irish republicans from the country. In the first book to focus on the relationship between these tools of exclusion and US foreign policy, Karen McElrath examines why this change has come about and the extent to which the granting of political asylum in the US is influenced by relations with Britain and other countries.Link

  30. You can’t compare Al-Arian case with of the IRA.

    After see those videos of Al-Arian in post #17, can anyone really still defend Al-Arian.

  31. all I want to know is that was any IRA funders, deported ???? (As majority IRA funding happened from the US)

    I don’t know, but then again, the IRA didn’t launch 9-11 so the level of scrutiny wouldn’t be the same. The United States lived in a self induced coma when it came to dealing with terrorist groups prior to the mid 90s, and even then it was way too slow in waking up. However, the skills that enables current terrorists to operate (bomb making in particular) can be traced back to the IRA. I think, don’t quote me on it, but various palestinian groups learned a few tricks of the trade from IRA folks back in the day.

  33. I don’t know, but then again, the IRA didn’t launch 9-11 so the level of scrutiny wouldn’t be the same.

    Palestanian groups didnt launch 9-11 either. But for an average american what’s the difference??

  34. From the link Vikram provided

    US law allows the INS to initiate deportation proceedings even when extradition has been denied for political offences. Stated differently, a person can ‘win’ or succeed in an extradition hearing, but be deported from the United States by the INS for entering the United States illegally.

    I dont think you understan what being a naturalized citizen is. It really means citizen, not illegal entrant.

    The second case in Vikram’s example is of William (Liam) Quinn who was natural born citizen of US but was extradited.

    Both of the examples DONT APPLY to the scenario Al-Arian was in.

  35. All’s not lost. The Son was found guilty..

    I can almost imagine Sam Waterston hammering on the father to accept a guilty plea in exchange for a sentencing recommendation for the son.

  36. The Son was found guilty..

    Ok, now I’ll take Abhi’s suggestion and have some ice-cream.

    M. Nam

  37. So if the father accepts a guilty plea, his son will get less jail time. But since there was a mistrail, How could the father do that.

  38. Mistrial doesn’t mean he’s innocent. The jury couldn’t decide unanimously and the goverment can have another go at him unless they feel it’s worthless (which would have happened if the son’s trial was mistried). I am not a lawyer… I used to watch way too many law & order episodes. In fact I’ve seen an episode where exactly the same thing happens to a father-son criminal enterprise.

  39. Hamid Hayat was convicted Tuesday of one count of providing material support to terrorists by attending the camp and three counts of lying about it to FBI agents.

    I can’t really blame the guy for not telling the FBI about attending the terrorist camp (if that is true).

    Does three counts of lying mean that he fibbed three times?

  42. The thing that worry’s me about the Lodi father and son duo is there location. My sister lives nearby, so do 5 pairs of aunt/uncles and 12 cousins, of which 11 are married and they have total of 21 kids, and my grandma, that 56 people in my family

    The thought they could be at wrong place at wrong time when these Lodi idiots do something worry me alot.

    The thing that worries me, PearlJamFan, are people like you and MoorNam and Vikram. I’m especially disappointed by you, PearlJamFan, because you give a bad name to Pearl Jam fans. And I kind of liked Ten.

    Ice cream for progressives/radicals!

  43. I have read Vikram and Moornam posts on this topic, and both of them have made alot of good points.

  44. They convicted the son based only on his entrapped confession? Do they have any material evidence he attended a terrorist training camp? Plane reservations, something?

  45. I have read Vikram and Moornam posts on this topic, and both of them have made alot of good points.

    Yes, ultra-conservatives tend to see the wisdom in each others words. 🙂

  46. I’m not ultra-conservative. I am in the centre, but would call myself a moderate democract. However when it comes to this issue, I may be very conservative.

  47. The thing that worries me, PearlJamFan, are people like you and MoorNam and Vikram

    As opposed to the people in this thread who express sympathy for a virulent anti-Semite and anti-American like Sami Al Arian. Right… somehow I don’t think those deductive powers will qualify you for MENSA…

  48. Ummm. Vikram, tell me, just how does one bring “deportation charges” against a U.S. citizen? It can’t be easy.

    not “deportation charges” but maybe a “secret plea deal”

    From his jail cell Friday, Sami Al-Arian secretly signed a plea deal that says he will be deported after pleading guilty to one count of conspiracy to help members of a terrorist organization.

    Link.

    Capping an ordeal that spanned more than a decade, former University of South Florida professor Sami Al-Arian has reached a deal with prosecutors, agreeing to be deported after admitting involvement with a terrorist organization, an attorney involved in the negotiations said.

    Link.

  49. Vikram,

    As opposed to the people in this thread who express sympathy for a virulent anti-Semite and anti-American like Sami Al Arian.

    I dont like the anti-semite views of Al-Arian one bit. I hate that shit. I love the jews and I think they are a community Indian-Americans should emulate. But I also do not like their stance on occupied territories. I am more with Dr. Eric Alterman on that, whose blog I love to read.

    The reason I was interested in that case is that for political actions He is being deported. What is the Gadar movement people were deported because they were fighting against occupation?? (Its a different thing that no body gave a fig about India and its freedom struggle back than in the US. The mainstream that is)