Mindy Kaling, who writes for and acts on the NBC show The Office, recently revealed to David Letterman a secret that many Indian Americans guard very closely. Not all of us are good at imitating an Indian accent just because our parents are Indian [via Defamer]:
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That’s right, we may not do Indian accents well…but no other ethnic group should be able to point that out without an indignant tongue-lashing back 
If you want to skip the rest of the interview then start at 1:30 min mark. I can really sympathize with Mindy. When I try to do an Indian accent I sound slightly Scottish. Its just sad.
Coz I’m from India and can tell one accent from another…
Oh that and I ask them where the call center is at. And I do this in a non-patronizing fashion too…call me paranoid but when I’m outside and am giving my card number or social security or pin as confirmation I would rather use a language that no one else around me understands.
152, RahulD – I hear you on that! My husband can speak 5 Indian languages and so when he makes a call, he usually finds out where that call center is and if he knows the local language, begins to speak in that language! Apart from not having to give out credit card number or SS# in English, it also makes the other person a bit relaxed to speak without the put-on accent. 🙂
153 · Manvantara
Yea its something I picked up from my parents and uncles who used to call from Russia or Australia and would always say it in Telugu or Hindi.
I just said Hindi because it is kind of common, I use Tamil or Telugu and do not try if it is Kannada because I sound like a jackass.
148 · nfa said
I don’t know what’s worse–that Katrina has turned everybody on the Gulf Coast into a sissy who’s scared of a little wind and rain or that it’s turned them all into armchair meteorologists. I’m sorry your party got (not) rained on. 😉 Here is an article I wrote in the wake of the Rita evacuation disaster a few years back–“Anti-Climax to the Max.”
Harbeer:
I don’t want you to have hurt feelings, but I think you’re actually looking for something to be hurt about on this thread, because it’s just not there.
Compared to the endless and often paranoid micro-dissection that goes on at SM when a white person asks an ABD where s/he “is really from�, and about how that is patronizing/ condescending/ racist, I am being quite thick-skinned here. Also if I were the only person, or even if it was only DBDs here that felt there is malicious mockery of Indian accents on SM, you would have sounded more convincing. Maybe it’s just that you haven’t encountered a DBD tell you that making fun of my accent offends me, and you are just too surprised that it could be so. Maybe you cannot appreciate the fact that for a DBD, the “diverse� but mono-accented universe of a US corporate board room or morning hospital rounds can be intimidating if s/he is constantly told that his/her accent is funny/intense/etc, even if otherwise perfectly understandable. Maybe you were wrong to assume that only the white guy should accommodate diversity and that color/culture is the only acceptable form of discrimination. And maybe you just need some sensitivity training.
My sisters and I never spoke Punjabi with our parents because they’d get all condescending and tell us how cute we sounded as they mocked the most minor slips in our American inflected Punjabi.
Sorry to be blunt, but that doesn’t sound convincing. There must be more credible reasons why you avoided speaking Punjabi at the time. I applaud that you took the effort later to learn the language. Everytime I meet an ABD who responds that they know absolutely no Hindi/ Telugu/Malayalam, or as some have put it “I am an embarrassment to (XYZ Indian language)�, I know the embarrassment lies elsewhere. And it is this embarrassment that is projected onto the unsuspecting newly arrived DBD who encounters his first ABD on the US campus or office.
Please spare me your saccharine self-righteous sanctimony.
I have realized that in the US you have to speak white elite liberal-ese to get through to the white aspirational class. It runs counter to my unreconstructed DBD instincts, but as is so obvious here, common decency isn’t sufficient enough an argument to convince people. Why, I might even get banned for unnecessarily disrupting the discussion.
Leaving a comment like this is a strange way of exhibiting your “common decency” and does nothing for your “argument” (which I still don’t understand by the way).
156 · annoyed said
i don’t think the solution to thinskinned offense-taking is competitive intolerance. can you please describe what comments on this thread you found mocking or offensive, instead of positing tautological generalities that malicious mockery is, well, malicious? and please get rid of the persecution complex – people here are actually engaging with you, your repeatedly attributing malice intent (“oh! i might be banned!”) without any provocation is really quite the mark of paranoia.
i am a fob (or dbd or h1-b visa holder or whatever other term has been approved by the pc police today) reader of this site, and i approve this message.
111 · Abhi said
Abhi, I meant that the FOB slur has frequently been used on SM. Maybe you cannot police every comment, but at least don’t use it to headline your blog posts. A couple of examples: Drop it like a FOB Abhi, i.e. you, 3/2005 Advice to the FOB wading ashore… Vinod, 10/2004 and even: Is FOB a fighting word? Ennis 5/2007, who asks innocently (at the end of a long post describing stabbing and firebombing between newly arrived and Canadian born Sri Lankan Tamils over being called FOB) : “Is FOB a highly offensive word?” In bold type!
Either I am this hypersensitive jerk or maybe you guys just don’t get it.
The typical discussion of DBDs on SM is that of a caricature: “Uncle”s and “Aunty”s with no depth or complexity forcing ABDs into arranged marriages; the recently arrived IT guy who is yet to discover deodorant, or other such attributes that are wildly funny, distasteful and/or mockworthy. If it is about a parent or a relative, there will be a mention of the immense affection the ABD has towards them, but the affection is towards the parent/ relative, and not for the demographic the caricature represents. As a DBD with no family in the US, the caricature and the mockery offends me. (Before somebody jumps the gun, pls read what I say here. You can still reminisce, share and bond without indulging in caricature or put-downs…..hey, so much of the Jewish migratory experience is about celebrating the difference between their generations. Btw, another of those groups that is not ashamed of their heritage.)
I will admit though that there has been a switch from FOB towards “DBD” lately for which I am grateful. I have been visiting SM since the days when the slur was the de facto and only way to reference IBIs, and see this as a huge improvement. Thanks for the effort.
In every post you point to above there was a specific contextual reason that word FOB was used and I would use again (except maybe the one by Vinod wayyyback in 2004 before we switched to the term DBD). As a matter of fact, I’ll see your examples with mine. I feel like you are guilty of the same thing you are accusing people here of. You are generalizing everyone and making it seem like the vast majority of people here are anti-FOB. In doing so your tone comes across anti-ABD. The use of FOB vs. DBD is contextual and we can’t expect everyone will adopt DBD over night (as most people will keep saying ABCD and not ABD).
Its a pity no one uses DCBA Desi Confused By America My Fraternity Brother called me that whenever I used to call him an ABCD 😛
Well I will now!
To: 162. Another ABCD
Yeees Yeees…It is working
Something Something Something Daaark Side…
(am I bringing down the intellectual level of the debate here?)
well said.For some reason,an innocent ‘where are you from’ asked by a white person elicits tut-tuts and chest-beating and war-mongers on this site(? because an ABD is almost as susceptible to this query as a DBD is)……I think in most cases its not ill-meant and at least upto now,I dont mind being asked where are you from a bit.However,I can quite understand how someone who was born in this country and has a blue passport might find it offensive and an identity-threatner.It seems that most ABD’s here would either exhibit outright resentment or an I-have-so-much-self-control-that-I-just-kept-quiet pat on the back.
Brilliant.
Yesss…..even though like all life experiences,everything seems like it was fun when played in flash-back…!!
And I dont think anyone here is looking for an excuse to or begging others to feel sorry about themselves/their situation.
Transplanting yourself half-way across the world ,strangers in a strange land,not having the ‘luxury’to be able to see your immediate family for months or years and in many cases,starting a job for the first time ever,does make you strong enough not to lie awake about your accents or ABD’s or who-hates-what-and-why.Trust me,if I was to start feeling sorry for myself(which I actually did for the first few months as an intern) I would have a million other things to worry about other than my accent or how someone who just happens to be the same color as me is disparaging/indifferent.
True. Then what really is your point?. Different people have different sensitivity scales on different issues. I’m going to generalise here a little bit based on the responses. pardon me.
ABDs take offence to the question “where are you really from?” DBDs take offense to the mocking of their accents.
One group thinks the other group is a bit extra sensitive on their respective issues. makes sense if you view throught each one’s prisms. Blogs / comments can help the different groups to understand (or atleast try to understand) each other viewpoints.
Thou asketh
And thou telleth thyself
While I did play the devil’s advocate earlier, I feel like on some level there is so much hypocrisy in suggesting that we can’t even make fun of each other in a jocular vein!
Oh my god, if we delved into how much Indians make fun of each other’s accent IN India, mockery here is mild…Growing up, even my cousins, used to make fun of both my Hindi (aside from the fact that “kaiku” IS a funny word) and my English !
I think, a lot of people (me included) don’t like it when ABDs do it, for reasons other than the fact that their accent is being mocked (namely that it is ABDs doing it); but no one seems to be acknowledging that! Instead we(from India) are all going “to be honest with you Diane, aahm Surpriizzed”
I’m pretty sure it’s the former, in this case.
168 · Camille said
Damn, girl! This from uber PC you? 😛
Naah, you would be ill advised to jump to the conclusion missy….in this world of murders and 9/11 and the holocaust and wars,anything that is discussed on SM could be construed as trivial or redundant or hyper-sensitive.
Just dont forget to remind me to send ‘you are a hypersensitive jerk’ card to your father/brother/cousins next time they get upset about someone calling them a terrorist/Osama/Iraqi etc etc.
Like, I totally agree….like, as in hundred percent pakka….
This is NOT about India vs America.Should not be too diffcult to judge between the two which one is more PC ( or SC,my nn for socially correct).For God sakes,I chose to move to this country over my hometown,my parents,the first quarter(hopefully) of my life….and not just for the money.I am sorry if in the midst of all the melee I forgot to mention how happy I am to be here vs back ‘there’.
Its about “perception” and “reality” and “all-thats-inbetween” of slights and insults and complexes ( and of course,DBD’s have an even bigotry package….the caste issues,hindus vs muslims,north vs south et etc),and ways to get past them.
165 “ABDs take offence to the question “where are you really from?”
DBDs take offense to the mocking of their accents. True. Then what really is your point? “ The point, Selvan anna, is that on this board the former is acknowledged, facilitated and empathized with, while the latter is denied, ridiculed or put on somebody’s fevered imagination. And before you tell me that this board was initially intended for ABDs, I know it and that doesn’t change anything one bit.
168 • “Camille said Either I am this hypersensitive jerk or maybe you guys just don’t get it.
I’m pretty sure it’s the former, in this case.
Damn, girl! This from uber PC you? :Pâ€
Well she is not the first person to pick and choose from the offerings of PCness to suit her concerns.
To DBDs who say that accent mocking exists in India, and is therefore kosher: If there had been a situation in which you had mocked my Malayalam accent (versus your “conventâ€/ Hindi/ Northie/ whatever accent), you would have heard from me. It has happened to me in India, and I have always given people who did it a piece of my mind. Malayallathille oru chollu ondu…but you wouldn’t follow And btw they have lately been doing pogroms in India- maybe we should replicate that everywhere.
It’s not that I don’t have a sense of humor. But like nfa pointed out, there is no humor involved in laughing at someone. And I am perceptive enough to make the difference.
cavity search, nfa, annoyed:
The issue is not a dichotomy of jerk vs. thoughtful and commanding revolutionary agent of good, which is how this conversation has been set up over the last 30 comments. Not only have nfa’s comments reeked of sanctimony, they’ve also purposefully read malice into a conversation where, for the most part, there was none (by all accounts, this has been a shockingly tame SM thread). Instead of meeting people where they’re at, there’s this overall tone of beating them over the head — even when they’re “on your side”! This is where my jerk comment comes from; not from the sentiment or thematic content of your comments, but from the uncivil tone (which, coincidentally has nothing to do with the “convenience” of a PC-attitude in this context). We all have our moments — goodness knows I’ve had mine –, but this one just keeps going and going and going and going… is it going to reach a conclusion, or is it to “make an example” of other posters and commenters?
nfa and annoyed, I have no idea what your intent or tone is, but I have feeling it’s to illustrate and emphasize that people (esp. DBDs) experience real and frustrating everyday racism on the basis of their accents and otherwise, and that ABDs are not exempt from perpetuating those stereotypes, biases, etc. If that’s the case, then all I’m asking is that you recognize the impact of your method of engagement on the tenor of the conversation. It doesn’t mean you shouldn’t bring up valid points or that you shouldn’t challenge people, but I do think it’s helpful to either assume good intent or maintain a holistic view of the conversation before assigning blame to others.
Sorry, nfa, I didn’t mean to ascribe a trait only to you — I meant to include annoyed, also, throughout. Again, my intent isn’t to blame anyone, but to explain how this is playing out in ways that really aren’t encouraging a discussion or helping either “side” make their point effectively.
171. NFA
Were you agreeing with me or disagreeing with me? I don’t quite get how what you said was related to what I said.
Also if you don’t mind can you explain the Cher Horowitz/Moon Zappa/Rudyard Kipling Sahib reference?
I like her but seriously, her name is NOT K-e-ling. it IS K-aa-ling.
178 · indranee said
Ya, I wondered about that too soon after the initial comment by Letterman that he had mispronounced her name. Chockalingam is pronounced “chok-ka-lingam” and not “chok-kay-lingam”. So what the probs? 😛
Camille,
“by all accounts, this has been a shockingly tame SM thread” Because it did not involve an issue where ABDs were passionately divided? Most discussions mentioning real life US DBDs on SM are one way streets, with the occasional DBD who will ingratiate himself into the conversation with a handle such as “fob” or “brown fob” and saying how he is mildly different/superior from the class being talked about. I have been coming to SM for several years now, but had never posted. I would always find the caricaturing immensely annoying, but bcos of real life reasons, could never actually post.
“they’ve also purposefully read malice into a conversation” FYI, much before I “purposefully read malice” or even had posted, an ABD had spotted it. Kudos to her.
We are essentially having a trans-cultural conversation here, even if we are speaking the same language. English is a third language for me and unlike for many of you, I have to try really hard to articulate what I feel. It would be helpful if you did not assume “tone” into my posts and focused on the content. With the earlier qualification, I can still pick up plenty of posts here that have an uncivil tone, and they are not by me (or nfa). My intent here is not to be disruptive, but to highlight an issue that exists, but which ABDs appear oblivious of. It is this systematic, persistent discounting of a real, felt problem that is annoying.
I am not a sanctimonious or rude person per se. I am actually quite mild, even with a sense of humor and if you knew me, you may even think I am cool! But some of the denial here had really aggravated me, especially because accent ridicule and discrimination is really just a symptom of the discrimination foreign born individuals face in the US, at work, socially, in the (even legal) immigration process and elsewhere. Sometimes when a discrimination is not articulated, it does not exist. Its the next frontier for the civil rights movement.
I apologize to anyone offended by my tone, as it was not my intention. This has taken quite a bit of my time, and I will hopefully not post again for the next few years and get on with facing some real life discrimination 🙂
annoyed, I hope I didn’t hurt you or dissuade you from writing. Thanks so much for clarifying. I wasn’t trying to read any negative intent into your (or nfa’s) posts, but the back and forth wasn’t going anywhere and was continuing to devolve. I think it’s difficult to because as a “new” commenter there’s a period of acculturation where others get used to your style, personality, concerns, etc. There are DEFINITELY other “uncivil” posts on this thread, but familiarity means I’m able to discount or weight someone’s comment based on their previous commenting history. In that sense, it really helps to have a person continue to comment over time because it’s easier to meet them where they’re at.
By calling this thread “relatively civil,” I only meant that, despite the barbs and jibes, this is relatively smooth. 🙂
Nopus copus.I am sorry if I failed to clarify ( but I think I did). There was,what I consider to be a failure to acknowledge/understand a certain viewpoint and that was mildly grating but I do not think there was,from my side, any allegation or even insinuation of malicious intent(at least from anyone on SM).That is not to say that the systematic malice is entirely non-existent ……your viewpoint seems to be ‘even if there is’,its ignoreworthy,my viewpoint is that,given the PCness that exists on SM otherwise, its not.Maybe that is all there is to it.
180 · annoyed said
don’t forget to leave ample time to feel sorry for yourself. all those hurt feelings might be offended if you don’t nurse them properly.
Annoyed, nfa, some of us are more complex than you might think.
156 · annoyed said
You know what? That is the truth and no offense but I don’t really care whether you believe me OR applaud me–just as I’d hope you don’t really give a hoot what I think. We’re just strangers passing by each other on teh interwebs, who cares? It’s Friday!
183 · fob said
Comments like this remind me of what I love about SM comment boards. Y’all can be so funneee 🙂
annoyed: Seriously, “next frontier for the civil rights movement”? I understand your point about not reading tone into your words, but your words do get a bit (unintentionally?) bombastic sometimes.
I’m not American born, but I washed up here in my early teens and had to assimilate pretty quickly. When teachers carefully ignore your waving hand in class because they don’t want the bother of trying to understand your “foreign” accent, and kids follow you around calling you “dot-head” (esp neat since I don’t wear a bindi) … color me talented but I sure did get my As pancake-flat and stopped rrrrrrrolling my Rs to sound like a proper midwesterner mighty darn quick.
Anyway, I understand how frustrating it can be when people focus on how you say something instead of what you’re actually saying. But most ABCD (ABD? what terms are we using for PC reasons again? I can’t keep up) commenters on SM talk about “FOBs” and “Aunties” and “Uncles” and accents with the kind of mockery that comes from and is tempered with love and a slight sense of longing… love for their accented FOB parents/aunts/uncles and a sense of longing for the South Asia they represent and talk about. Going to visit is never the same as being “from” there, you know? They are just different, and that difference, with no judgements, is what this blog tries to address…. I think 🙂
I used to think it was rather ridiculous how ABD kids would obsess (in my eyes) over parent’s tea drinking habits or desi dishes or some other minor detail…I was trying to Americanize as fast as I possibly could and dealing with geopolitical identity issues (was a very angsty teen) and here they were bragging about how they could also make dhal? But I’ve been here so long I can’t say I’m ‘from’ my country of birth anymore and I’ve caught myself getting weirdly excited when I find someone else who likes Marmite.
So my point is, please don’t assume the motives of everyone who comments or what this blog is about based on your interpretation of our interpretation of a few words.
185 · Cicatrix said
And your last comment reminds me of what I love about SM. That was brilliant and beautiful. Thank you.
Speechless
thanks 🙂
That’s because Letterman was thinking of a different pronunciation for Chokalingam.
Or in Tamil: Vera Chokalingam.
That’s because Letterman was thinking of a different pronunciation for Chokalingam.
Or in Tamil: Vera Chokalingam.
Oh man, I almost cracked up at work. Well played.
Choke a lingam? Or is it “chock (full of) lingam”?
How about “chota lingam”?