Bye Bye Nalgene?

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We may be seeing the end of the ubiquitous Nalgene bottle, like the one sitting on the corner of my office desk that I drink from continuously throughout the day. The Canadian government is about to declare bisphenol-a, or B.P.A, a toxic chemical:

The Nalgene is dead.

B.P.A. is widely used to make polycarbonate plastics, which are rigid and transparent like glass but very unlikely to shatter…Because animal tests have shown that even small amounts of the chemical may cause changes in the body, however, researchers have focused on food- and drink-related applications of B.P.A., like the popular Nalgene brand beverage bottles. [Link]

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p>The US government may be moving in the same direction, albeit more slowly:

… a draft report from the United States Department of Health and Human Services’ National Toxicology Program endorsed a scientific panel’s finding that there was “some concern” about neural and behavioral changes in humans who consume B.P.A. [Link]

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p>The debate about the health impact on humans will probably continue for a while, but one way or another, Nalgene’s days as the dominant water jug are over as people decide that they’d rather be safe than sorry. I’m probably going to be one of them, since I don’t have the expertise necessary to evaluate the health claims myself.

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p>So how will I keep myself hydrated? Well, I’m thinking of rocking it old school. What would be better than a stainless steel jug and tumbler to keep in my office? You know, the kind with the rough edge that you can feel on the underside of your lip as you drink the water with the slightly metallic tang? Nalgene never induced nostalgia like this.

Now if only I could replace my office chair with a charpoy …

53 thoughts on “Bye Bye Nalgene?”

  1. I use a glass bottle, myself. ^__^

    Can’t remember when I first read that bisphenol-A messed up hormones… maybe a year ago.

    Go Canada!

  2. fyi – bpa containing products have the number 7 within the recycling triangle symbol. it goes beyond nalgene.

    the migratory rate jumps if you add boiling water to the bottle, as . when sterilizing baby bottles .

    i wont be surprised if rei follows up on this. fyi, locally the steel bottles are flying off the shelves at the local stores but buddy here plans to stick to his red and white nalgene. our middle name is danger.

  3. I have that exact amber nalgene bottle sitting on my desk right now. I guess it’s time to buy a Sigg.

  4. Ha! Am torn between a Sigg and a Klean Kanteen. There’s something appealing about getting a stainless steel bottle, although the Sigg do look cool.

  5. What about an earthenware “kooja” which also keeps the water cool because of the evaporation of the tiny amount of water that seeps through to the outer surface?

  6. Aah… drinking cool water from a steel glass on a hot day….something I really miss! I have switched to Sigg for sometime now..but they don’t provide that metallic tang. I had heard somewhere that as per ayurveda, it is good to drink water from glass made of brass. Is there any truth to that ?

    What about tupperwares that desis so love ? How toxic are those ?

  8. despite my attempts to change things around here, my fam still uses stainless steel almost-everything (in fact, i’m sipping water from one right now). gotta admit, though, water does have a certain ‘wah!’ when consumed from a steel glass 🙂 i’d like to know…is it common for families to hang onto their stainless steel stuff?

    zuni, to answer your question… yes, having water charged by certain metals (brass, gold, silver, etc.) is an ayurvedic practice. (i’m having trouble finding a good web resource for you…sorry!)

  9. The debate about the health impact on humans will probably continue for a while, but one way or another, Nalgene’s days as the dominant water jug are over as people decide that they’d rather be safe than sorry.

    All due respect, Ennis, but the Bisphenol-A issue is beginning to look like the “mercury in the fish” scare or even the EU’s GMO conceit–insurers have been contemplating a comprehensive bisphenol-a exclusion for a while now but nothing has happened (partly because of how widely it’s used) because of how confident insurers have become in predicting US regulatory action. I don’t think it’s even remotely likely that the US will jump on the bisphenol-a scare wagon.

    that being said, are there any actual scientist who could explain this in layman’s threat terms?

  10. Now if only I could replace my office chair with a charpoy …

    And put a lota beneath the toilet paper. Heck, sit on the charpoy, smoke a bidi or a hookah and you can have a panchayat in the conference room.

  11. All due respect, Ennis, but the Bisphenol-A issue is beginning to look like the “mercury in the fish” scare

    Explain – pregnant women are still warned not to eat larger, carnivorous fish because of concentrations of mercury in them. Are you saying that’s entirely a misnomer?

    What I was trying to say about BPA is whatever the actual health risks, once the Canadian government acts to ban it, consumers will shy away, even if they are in countries (like the US) where the government has not acted.

  12. 11 · Ennis said

    Explain – pregnant women are still warned not to eat larger, carnivorous fish because of concentrations of mercury in them. Are you saying that’s entirely a misnomer?

    No, it’s not a bad suggestion for pregnant women (but the quantitative limits don’t seem to be obvious–how much tuna is too much? Must one conduct tests on individual tuna steaks to determine merc levels?)–just that people who don’t feel knowledgeable enough to make the decision will choose risk avoidance rather than mitigation. As you indicated that you were likely to stop using your Nalgene bottle (something i’d only feel necessary once they establish lowest harmful dose and what level of saturation is unacceptable–unless they’ve already done so and i’ve missed it), I see the BPA scare as part of a group of health warnings that get applied to a much larger proportion of the population than is justifiable.

  13. I’ve been hearing about this from different sources all week! My Nalgene is going in the recycle bin just as soon as my new bottle from Kleen Kanteen arrives…

  15. For a change, I’m going to provide some actual information.

    It is true that bisphenols are used as additives in polycarbonates, which are used not only for bottles, but also for blender jars and for optical disks (CDs, DVDs and all have a polycarbonate base). Not all polycarbonate-based products use the same additives or fillers.

    That said, it’s important to remember that not all bottles and vessels are made from polycarbonates. Indeed, look at the bottom of your bottle or other food container. If it says PETE, it’s polyethyleneterephthalate, which is perfectly fine, as are LDPE, HDPE and LLDPE (low/high/linear low density polyethylene), which are used for things like Gladware, gallon jugs of milk or juice, shopping bags and trash bags, all depending on the fillers used. PS (polystyrene) is fine too – Styrofoam is made by injecting gas bubbles into a polystyrene melt.

    So, you don’t need to abandon plastics altogether. As for the polycarbonate/bisphenols, wait for more information. Until then, it’s your choice whether to use them as food holders or not.

    Also, Styrofoam is perfectly fine even though it contains dihydrogen monoxide.

  16. What would be better than a stainless steel jug and tumbler to keep in my office?

    A copper jug.

  17. Also:

    Look at the recycle symbol on your plastic bottle. Polycarbonates will generally be labeled “OTHER” with a “7” inside the recycle triangle. You can usually recycle PETE and HDPE at the curbside, while LDPE is recycled based on its form factor (like shopping bags may go back to the grocery store instead of the curbside).

    There is a minor scare that reusing PETE bottles could leach out a minor carcinogen, but for my money, the chance of getting a bacterial infection or other biological threat is far higher, so I don’t bother with it.

  19. I totally use steel cups and plates, etc. in my apartment. I handed a glass to my (non-brown) friend once and was met with, “wow, this is quite a glass!” Ahh, the quiet exotic…

  20. 14 · Ardy said

    Well, being hydrated is not as important as one would think.

    Are you kidding? I started drinking 100oz a day based on my trainer’s requirements and let me tell you – I’ve noticed a HUGE difference in my skin, eyes, energy, digestion, etc.

    I will admit that 100oz is on the extreme side (acceptable to me based on what my physical activity and height/weight are), but 64 oz should definitely be a minimum if you are merely walking around this earth (as my trainer likes to say).

  21. maybe now people will stop laughing at me when I say I’m only going to be using bpa-free baby bottles.

  22. 16 · Divya said

    A copper jug.

    Are you trying to poison Ennis?

  24. Ok, the list I just posted seems to have suddenly died. Here’s another As quick description, these are aluminum bottles so no weird plasticy after-taste. Sturdy camping gear. I moved to these from Nalgene a few years ago and haven’t looked back.

  26. 25 · Divya said

    Oh no! I was thinking more along these lines.

    You’ve expressed time and again about how life is boring without danger. So, yeah, copper jugs are a good choice in that case 🙂

    PS: perhaps your jugs the jugs you recommended are made of specially treated Cu. Otherwise, Cu in water doesn’t seem to be such a great idea.

  27. Had the same scare a few days ago when the Consumer Reports article came out. We threw out everyone’s #7 bottle and made a trip to REI. Besides the pricey Sigg bottles, they have a number of plastic bottles for sale that are marked BPA-free.

  29. PS: perhaps your jugs the jugs you recommended are made of specially treated Cu. Otherwise, Cu in water doesn’t seem to be such a great idea.

    Port, my grandmother drank water out of water stored overnight in a copper lota and she lived on to a bright and healthy 86 and died without being sick (except for the last 3 months or so of her life). So I’m inclined to believe the ayurvedic claims about copper.

  30. 15 · pingpong said

    “It is true that bisphenols are used as additives in polycarbonates………..not all npolycarbonate-based products use the same additives or fillers.”

    Small correction: Bisphenol-A (BPA) is not just an additive for polycarbonates, it is by far the most widely used monomer for polycarbonate synthesis. If it were an additive, it could have been replaced, but replacing BPA with something else is a very very tough problem. As far as I know, there is no real, practical, cheap alternative (someone correct me if I am wrong).

    Banning polycarbonates is the easy part, finding replacements will be the real headache. LDPE, HDPE, PET etc don’t have quite the same temperature resistance and other properties, and some other comparable polymers are not cheap enough for bulk commodity applications. BPA-polycarbonates are not just used for bottles; the biggest market for them is CD/DVDs (as some have already mentioned). Brand names include not just Nalgene but also Lexan, Makrolon, Calibre, etc.

    I’m not qualified enough to comment on the health aspects of BPA, but I don’t see it being banned in the US anytime soon. Like I said, finding an alternative is hard, and the industrial lobby (GE, Dow, Bayer are the major players here) will not take it lying down.

  32. Ravi:

    You’re right. BPA is more than just an additive. I stand corrected. I had mentioned the other plastics (PE/PETE/PS) as replacements for Ennis’s Nalgene bottle rather than as industry-wide substitutes for polycarbonates. For instance, I currently use paper coffee cups at work to drink water from the cooler/fountain.

  33. perhaps your jugs the jugs you recommended

    Port, you should get the “Unnecessary Clarification Award”. I’m sure that you’re licking (your own) lips in anticipation.

  34. 29 · Divya said

    Port, my grandmother drank water out of water stored overnight in a copper lota and she lived on to a bright and healthy 86 and died without being sick (except for the last 3 months or so of her life). So I’m inclined to believe the ayurvedic claims about copper.

    an n of 1 is usually enough for me, but you know, try convincing those nitpicking peer reviewers. again, i suspect all depends on the type of cu jug used, and the temperature of water contained therein, but after looking at that table, it is unlikely that i will be considering a cu jugs myself. jugs made of natural materials are the best. in fact, i told my friend pamela andersen about the benefits of having natural jugs, and she considered my advice. her house is now dotted with surahis. and ping: i like taking precautions. for want of a word, millions were lost. in fact, my bright and healthy 86 year old gran told me, “clarify not butter, but words that you utter.”

  35. 29 · Divya said

    PS: perhaps your jugs the jugs you recommended are made of specially treated Cu. Otherwise, Cu in water doesn’t seem to be such a great idea.
    Port, my grandmother drank water out of water stored overnight in a copper lota and she lived on to a bright and healthy 86 and died without being sick (except for the last 3 months or so of her life). So I’m inclined to believe the ayurvedic claims about copper.

    My grandmother did the same, saying it was good for her joints. I don’t mean to be crude, but how do you know that if she hadn’t done the copper thing, she’d have lived to a bright and healthy 96, instead of 86?

  36. My grandmother did the same, saying it was good for her joints. I don’t mean to be crude, but how do you know that if she hadn’t done the copper thing, she’d have lived to a bright and healthy 96, instead of 86?

    No way of knowing that, but I just checked my vitamin bottle and it includes copper among the ingredients. So I’d rather believe that drinking water out of a copper jar gets you some of the goodness that copper is supposed to provide, rather than believe that paranoid report about it. Plus it looks pretty.

  37. There’s a common misconception that every product with an SPI code of 7 contains BPA. It actually is a catch-all category that lumps together all plastics that aren’t categorized within 1-6. For example, corn-based and plant based bioplastics are categorized as number 7s, and they are the safest plastics on earth.

    To learn more about the classification system, check out Californians Against Waste: http://www.cawrecycles.org/issues/plastic_campaign/resin_code.

  39. 36 · Divya said

    No way of knowing that, but I just checked my vitamin bottle and it includes copper among the ingredients.

    Yeah, you need some Cu (it’s a ‘trace’ nutrient) for optimal functioning, but beyond a certain threshold it is toxic. that’s common enough, e.g. megadoses of vitamin a aren’t a great idea either.

    calling some evidence ‘paranoid’ is a time-honored strategy for dismissing it without consideration, but yeah, you’re right on this one divya (actually, are you ever wrong?. it is well-known that the national Committee on Copper in Drinking Water, (part of the National Research Council, ) published by the national academies press is filled with the looney fringe of biased scientists who’ve a grudge against the EPA.

    The National Research Council was requested to form a committee to review the scientific validity of the EPA’s maximum contaminant level goal for copper in drinking water. Copper in Drinking Water outlines the findings of the committee’s review. The book provides a review of the toxicity of copper as well as a discussion of the essential nature of this metal. The risks posed by both short-term and long-term exposure to copper are characterized, and the implications for public health are discussed. This book is a valuable reference for individuals involved in the regulation of water supplies and individuals interested in issues surrounding this metal.
  42. If it says PETE, it’s polyethyleneterephthalate, which is perfectly fine, as are LDPE, HDPE and LLDPE (low/high/linear low density polyethylene), which are used for things like Gladware, gallon jugs of milk or juice, shopping bags and trash bags, all depending on the fillers used.

    I just looked at the plastic bottle I use and it is HDPE, with the 2 symbol (a full list of symbols and meanings is here, btw), which means I am safe from BPA, I guess. But I have to say the water has this weird plasticky taste to it, which I don’t enjoy in the least.

    No way of knowing that, but I just checked my vitamin bottle and it includes copper among the ingredients. So I’d rather believe that drinking water out of a copper jar gets you some of the goodness that copper is supposed to provide

    Hmm, maybe I should lick those iron girders from the construction project next door after all 🙂

    Although, speaking of traditional metals for vessels, Tamilians (is it a Brahmin thing? I don’t know) traditionally cook their rasam in a vessel made of a material called eeyam, which melts at temperatures less than the boiling point of water, and so supposedly adds flavor to the rasam (people swear by the taste of rasam cooked in these traditional pots). Eeyam means lead, but I don’t think these pots themselves are made of lead. Do people know what combination of metals is used for this?

  43. 42 · Rahul Eeyam means lead, but I don’t think these pots themselves are made of lead. Do people know what combination of metals is used for this?

    I’m pretty sure it’s mainly tin, but I think it’s an alloy, and don’t know what the other metal(s) are.

  44. Hmm, maybe I should lick those iron girders from the construction project next door after all 🙂

    Not a bad idea! I’m sure that would cause less of a stomach upset than the iron pills do.

  45. I gave my man (from TN) a deep cast iron pot for making his rasam. It gives it that extra healing power!

  46. 45 · bess said

    I gave my man (from TN) a deep cast iron pot for making his rasam. It gives it that extra healing power!

    Dr. Bess, I’ll wager that of all the myriad forms of healing you can provide, this one is his favorite. He’s probably “can’t wait for you to op-uh-raate.”

    [Sorry, I know I’m cheesy, but I loooove this song. But seriously, yeah, I hope those rasam pots are safe. Cuz I love the Tamizh folk.]

  47. For some reason I always play the patient.

    [Sorry, I know I’m cheesy, but I loooove this song. But seriously, yeah, I hope those rasam pots are safe. Cuz I love the Tamizh folk.]

    Cheesy? Never! I can’t tell you how many times you’ve slayed me with that humor of yours. Please don’t hold back. And now that I have that song in my head, I’m roller reminscin’ again. Anybody want to couple skate? We could play doctor later ; ) That is, after we talk about the Nalgene bottle safety issue. (My attempt to stay on topic.)

  48. Tamilians (is it a Brahmin thing? I don’t know) traditionally cook their rasam in a vessel made of a material called eeyam, which melts at temperatures less than the boiling point of water, and so supposedly adds flavor to the rasam (people swear by the taste of rasam cooked in these traditional pots). Eeyam means lead, but I don’t think these pots themselves are made of lead. Do people know what combination of metals is used for this?

    As rob said, the eeyachombu is usually tin-based – people who eat habitually hot food in lead vessels rarely live long enough to pass it on to younger generations! I have heard the words “veLLai eeyam” for tin and “karuppu eeyam” for lead, but I don’t know if they are in widespread use. But no matter which metals were used, their melting points are generally over 200 Celsius, so there can’t be any possible accident with boiling water. It’s possible however that placing the eeyachombu straight on the stove will cause it to deform or melt and clog the burner holes, so the hot rasam is usually poured into the chombu after it has been boiled in a another (non-eeyam) vessel.

    No idea whether it really changes the flavor – it’s hard to taste a few milligrams of dissolved metal under all the pepper and/or garlic.

  50. Looks like Nalgene is going to phase out bottles containing BPA:

    In response to consumer demand, Nalgene® will phase out production of its Outdoor line of polycarbonate containers that include the chemical Bisphenol-A (BPA) over the next several months, it announced today. Nalgene’s existing product mix, including the recently launched Everyday line, already features a number of containers made from materials that do not contain BPA.

    click for the whole article via http://www.nalgene-outdoor.com/