Oh, this story is so sad (thanks, Filmfat).
Police have charged a Brampton woman who sent hundreds of rambling emails to Premier Dalton McGuinty with threatening a member of his staff – but she contends it’s all a cultural misunderstanding.
Neelam Vir is also prohibited from contacting McGuinty, his family, staff or any other politician, and barred from Queen’s Park.
“I never meant to harm anyone,” says a tearful Vir, 40. “My Canadian dream is shattered. I just want to go back to India.”
The level of misunderstanding in this story is so epic, it could be a script for a comedy of errors. Unfortunately, a confused woman was jailed twice for her inability to negotiate different cultural norms; that’s not really funny-haha.
The charge follows an incident on Sept. 30, when Vir sent a packet of mix for making gulab jamun, an Indian sweet, to McGuinty to express her “love and affection,” dropping it off to staff member Monica Masciantonio.
The same night, she emailed McGuinty, asking whether Masciantonio had given him the mix.
“I said, `If she didn’t give it to you, I’ll kill her.’ It’s just slang,” Vir said. “I use this term all the time with my husband and my kids. In Hindi, it’s, `Mein tumarhi jaan nikal dungi.'”
Well, you can surmise what occurs next…
Vir received no reply but, on Nov. 20, after the election, half a dozen police officers showed up at her door. They confiscated her laptop, cellphone, camera and papers, and hauled her to jail on a charge of conveying a death threat. There she spent a frantic six hours until her husband bailed her out. “I was so upset I couldn’t stop crying. I kept asking, `What wrong did I do?'”
But wait, it gets worse. In a move which inspires forehead-slapping, poor Vir frantically emails the Premier to make amends and proclaim her good intentions…which results in a second arrest, for violating the terms of her release. For her clueless efforts, Vir was gifted with a psych consult. But let’s start from the very beginning, a very good place, to start…
Vir’s tale starts with the typical immigrant story of struggle and a quest for belonging.
After immigrating in 2002, she and husband Baljinder could not find jobs in their fields though both have PhDs attained in India – hers in botany and his in entomology. So Baljinder opened a butcher shop, and Vir temporarily returned to India to teach. She also completed a degree in education there, but after returning to Canada in 2005 could only find supply-teaching jobs and work as an airport security guard.
As a freelance writer for a Punjabi newspaper in Mississauga, she often met politicians at community events. A prolific emailer, she sent messages – mainly decrying the plight of foreign-trained professionals – to Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Immigration Minister Diane Finley, the provincial labour, education and health ministers and provincial opposition leader John Tory, many of whom she had met on assignment.
She didn’t just “send” emails…she SENT emails:
She sent the first of about 200 rambling emails to McGuinty last July. “In India, you can’t even approach a politician. Here, they’re accessible and open to hearing from constituents, so that’s what I was doing,” Vir says.
Prepare to cringe and feel awful:
Thrilled to get a form-letter reply from McGuinty that used her first name, Vir mailed him a rakhi (symbolic thread) last August, referring to him as “Big B,” her big brother.
At a Sept. 17 Liberal news conference at a Toronto bookstore, Vir handed McGuinty’s teacher wife, Terri, her resumé in the misguided hope she might help her find a job.
Vir took her daughters, Aanchal, 14, and Muskan, 9, to meet McGuinty during a roundtable with Punjabi media in Woodbridge on Sept. 28 where she heard him say he likes gulab jamun. The premier posed for photos with the trio, who presented him with bouquets and handmade cards.
Aanchal is failing in school as a result of all this unintentional, unnecessary craziness. Vir needs pro-bono representation. Canada needs to get a grip:
Shalini Konanur, the clinic’s executive director, calls the incident an overreaction to an honest mistake.
“One of the trickiest things when you move into a new society is understanding what’s colloquially appropriate communication. It’s almost impossible for new immigrants to navigate. I think she realizes now it was a mistake, but really, how would she have known? There’s no settlement agency that teaches you how to be politically correct in Canada.”
It’s a question of cultural semantics, adds the Toronto-born Konanur. “In some parts of India it’s quite common to speak that way. … I can’t speak for all Indian people, but in my family in India they use that kind of language all the time, `Get the milk or I’m going to kill you.'”
She believes the incident could have been kept out of court if officials had consulted agencies that deal with immigrant settlement.
“Obviously on one hand they want to take the safety of the premier and his staff into account, but there really needs to be a vetting of legitimate threats and ones that are made as honest mistakes.”
Nothing seems to be working out:
Vir is supposed to report back to India for a teaching job in June, but she isn’t allowed to leave the country.
“I’m going through hell for a silly mistake. If I’m guilty of anything, it’s being naive,” she said.
“I supported the Liberals in the election. Now I feel they betrayed me.”
I hope this women gets the help she needs, and that people who read rambling emails for the premier– and probably forward them all over the office for kicks– acquire some common sense. Heavy-handed much?
she immigrated in 2002 and then in 2005. how long does it take for a PhD to understand the cultural/political/social mores of another country?
Dalton must have been elated when he heard he had a stalker, but he must have known, deep-down, that someone as bland as he could never elicit such emotion.
In my family, we always threaten to kill each other. It’s no big deal.
1 · Bol said
Large parts of brampton are majority sikh. There’s a good chance she wasn’t exposed to the mainstream cultural/political/social mores of Canada in the years she lived here. I feel bad leaving this enormous target for pearljamfan, but that is the reality. There are plenty of ethnic enclaves in Toronto where someone could go for very long lengths of time w/o speaking English if they really wanted to. This isn’t just browns, also various east asians, the italians in the past, greeks etc. It’s a city of mini-cities..
4 · retorts said
Oh, goodness…I thought this was obvious. Should have stated such in the post. Thanks for contributing that. 🙂
🙂
Her behaviour is embarrassing. She seems well qualified but apparently not well educated.
Given her insistent nature, I assume her preferred mix is Gits?
We at the Jalebi Liberation Front (JLF) condemn the terrorist attack by the Gulab Jamun in the strongest possible terms. It is a despicable act of terrorism, for which no excuse or justification is possible. We express our condolences to those who were injured.
The burden of responsibility for preventing terrorist attacks such as this one rests within the Gulab Jamun community. We have noted reactions by several Gulab terrorist groups, including the Gulab Revolutionary Armed Brigade of Britain, Australia, Liechtenstein, and Somalia (GRABBALS), that defend or even applaud the barbaric act of terror committed. The American chapter of GRABBALS, Gulab Association Yankee (GAY), should remember that defense or sponsorship of terrorist acts by their officials will have the gravest effects on relations with the JLF.
I would have freaked out too if I had rcvd 200 emails.
7 · bulbul said
Like I said, I cringed…but I’m feeling more compassion than embarrassment. It’s easy for me as a 2nd gen to respond, “what was she THINKING?”, but I grew up here. Besides, I wonder if there is some element of mental illness involved in this situation, and that makes me sad for her.
I remember Uncles who behaved this way when I worked for my local Congressman back in the day…we just rolled our eyes, filed their missive, form lettered a response and mailed them back…but we didn’t over-react. And this was when our office was getting death threats, b/c of NAFTA.
When the mounties got the complaint, was there not a single desi cop on the squad to clarify?
Rakhee? Gulab Jamun mix? Anna, I am with you, there’s probably a psychological issue with her social filters. Wait, Big B? 200 emails to just this one guy? Stalking she was.
12 · SkepMod said
Your comment reminds me of the “wedding detective” thread, wherein someone mentioned that in India, stalking is considered a bona-fide strategy for wooing. Sigh.
I can see some of her behavior being excused by not growing up here and by the fact she probably lives in an ethnically similar region where she doesn’t get introduced as quickly to western norms. However, for someone who has been living here for as long as she has, her behavior seesm suspect. But then again, some of the comments the aunties and uncles make at parties make me cringe and they have been living her for over 30 years and in an ethnically diverse region. So I guess you can the desi out of the desh but not the desh out of the desi!
14 · BadIndianGirl said
I know Aunties and Uncles who live in ethnically similar regions, who don’t ever get introduced to western mores, forget quickly. 🙂 They’ve got satellite television, smuggled movies, cheap ways to call India and when they rarely leave the home, they socialize with other people who have and do the same. They hardly have occasion to speak English!
Maybe her peers had never written a politician or worse, told her that it doesn’t matter, “you can send as many letters as you want, it doesn’t do anything…”…I don’t know. Her behavior seems so suspect, I wonder if she can really be held accountable for it. There’s something very child-like and naive about her approach…we don’t know her medical history or what may have happened to her after she got her PhD. I’d love to know what the result of the psych consult was…
200 emails, rakhi , Big B, gulab jamun mix….this sure looks a bit out of the ordinary to me. Also, the fact she is able to communicate well enough in english and is educated would mean that she can negotiate basic cultural norms. Granted in desh we do tend to use the expression “I will kill you” in regular conversation, I dont think anyone would use it someone they didn’t know very well or in a formal situation.
I read the whole news story (though not anything else on the situation)–and I think it’s important to note that: (1) she doesn’t appear to have been convicted of anything yet, so perhaps the Canadian judicial system will sort this out correctly in the end, and (2) in terms of what a “correct” outcome is, it would be critical to know what exactly is in the rest of the 200 e-mails before we put a definitive interpretation on any particular e-mail that has been mentioned in the press to date. Very interesting story–thanks for posting, and please keep us updated if there are any developments!
15 · A N N A said
I agree that we don’t know the full medical history and that could explain some of her behavior. Also, you reminded me of my little cousin who moved here at 16 after living in Bombay her whole life. It was hard for her to pick up on all the cultural nuances and terms becuase they are so different. It was cute how she would ask me or my sister what something meant when she got home from school because she was too embarrassed to ask her friends.
Hopefully she will get the help she needs, psychological and legal.
As they say back home in the pind
Translation: Love is a wonderful thing.
OK. I’ll find the plot soon. Apologies for the diversion.
Mcguinty as spoken publicly on this saying that he thinks this is a sad case [to echo anna]. also tacitly acknowledged that he first heard about this from the newspaper. i do agree that this could have been handled more sensitively. unfortunately, the situation is such that they’ll try to follow the process to the best extent possible but it will be difficult to sweep stuff under the rug. mcguinty btw comes across as a generally fine person and has the right stuff to run for PM some day. it isnt that mcguinty is unaware of the ontario-desis. he led a trade delegation to india in march 2007 and has gone around courting the indian community at various relgious-cultural ceremonies.
This story seems to be a comedy of errors comparable to that original classic farce.
I empathize with her daughters, though I never had to deal with parental embarassment that had the potential to be this emotionally crippling. How will she suppress this?
Poor woman… she just wanted to get his attention.
Large parts of brampton are majority sikh. There’s a good chance she wasn’t exposed to the mainstream cultural/political/social mores of Canada in the years she lived here. I feel bad leaving this enormous target for pearljamfan, but that is the reality
Large parts of brampton are majority punjabi[Sikhism is there religon]. How can you not make any effort to learn culture of you new country that come. I blame white liberals as much as anyone. I could say more, but I will save it for another rant about this topic at a another time.
Oh, her poor daughters. I can’t even imagine what crap they are facing in school! Well, I can. She does seem to have a screw loose!
I’ve also heard, “I’ll kill you”, used lightly here in USA as well. But yeah, writing it in a letter to a politician is weird.
I can understand the cultural disconnect though. Went through the same thing in India.
It takes time to “get” the psyche or ethos of any given culture.
Wow, this woman is stupid and lazy. Who sends a mix packet? GJs are hard to make — you have to fry them on a low flame, the syrup has to be made etc. She should be lucky they did not think the white powder was something more dangerous! If this was in the US they would have probably deported her for “biohazard tactics” or some such nonsense charge.
I know Aunties and Uncles who live in ethnically similar regions, who don’t ever get introduced to western mores, forget quickly. 🙂 They’ve got satellite television, smuggled movies, cheap ways to call India and when they rarely leave the home, they socialize with other people who have and do the same. They hardly have occasion to speak English!
Well that makes my parents very different since they grew up in area that had only 25 desi familes[mostly punjabi] in area of 75,000 people. My Parents when they moved there 35 years ago made an effort to make friends with the local population[ they have many of the same friends since the mid 70’s], and learn the customs. I was glad my sister grow up that way, cause she probably had more freedom as a teenager then 99% of punjabi girls growing up in the west. My Sister was a straight A student[NYU Grad] who now works in Time Square in New York in the business world. Also my parents still don’t have a dish, and watch mostly western programs on TV. My mom has been watching Guilding Light and As the world turns since I was a kid.
Yet many people in the Vancouver punjabi community take shots at the way we were raised. Some of these people have sons or grandsons who were in gangs, a few have even lost there lifes, yet they still think they did a better job of raising there kids. There is where some my anger at the punjabi community comes from, dealing with all this crap.
27 · Suki Dillon said
I hear you, Suki. I think people who came here 30-40 years ago have similar experiences. They were forced to venture out and integrate, there wasn’t a choice like there is now.
Anna and Suki–too true–my parents, for example, don’t really interact at all with the more insular sort of desis–in other words, probably more than 50% of their friends are desis, but they’re all desis who have to some significant degree integrated into the broader culture–the non-integrated desis, my parents only encounter at temple (and then they complain to me about them!).
So, they waited until she sent out hundreds of e mails and until after the election to levy the charges?
Suki, as a fellow Canadian I empathize with your sentiments on this subject. I have a pretty mixed (leaning negative) view how Canada’s official multicultural policy has played out. The sentiment’s good, and desirable, but in practice it (or rather, it, in conjunction with a variety of other peculiarities of how a good portion of immigration plays out in Canada) has lead to a lot of counterproductive self-segregation. My parents have lots of Indian friends, and lots of non-Indian ones. When we first moved to Canada we spent a few years growing up in rural NF where, well, I was pretty much the only non-newfie around; that more or less eliminates any impulse to self-segregate 😉
Reaction from the Premier
31 · jackal said
Who’s to say the same thing wouldn’t have happened without official multiculturalism? Anna says she’s seen the same thing in the States, where there is no official policy promoting multiculturalism. This has nothing to do with govt policy, it’s a problem with some first generation immigrants not being quite as cosmopolitan as your parents. The severity of these hiccups ranges, but I think they’re inevitable in places like Canada/the UK/UK where migration is so significant.
No, no–things are worse in Canada. You don’t have the problems Suki talks about (and documents!) at anything like that level here in the US. Not that the level is zed. 😉
I don’t buy it. If she hadn’t learnt much about Canada, she’d be using an Indian formal register in letters, especially when addressing a politician. While I sympathize with the “I’ll kill you” faux pas, at best she’s a borderline stalker.
look, it’s kanada!?!?! didn’t someone tell her that when it comes to speech you have to be careful about what you say and who you talk to? they have komissars up there remember.
Great point, Razib–see, e.g., the Mark Steyn travesty.
also, No Obscenity, Please. We’re Canadian. there are some ways that kanada is actually more like the american south than the north….
Bah, more FUD from American corporate media. Those videos are prohibited for importation to protect our fledging bondage industry. We just call it obscene to avoid charges of protectionism from WTO and NAFTA.
kanadian porn is weak….
kanadian porn starz. itz cold up there, hey?
Hence the protectionism. Plus, most people here just do it for the various taxcredits and grants.
Canada is pretty f’cked up when it comes to diversity and cultural understanding.
Sure, it has a simpler self-immigration process, but then it doesn’t have the jobs to meet the immigrant demand. So, all these PhDs run shops, drive taxis and the only positive aspect is probably that they are in a first world country, as opposed to third world India/asia. How nice. Thankyou, come again.
Couple of years ago, There was this incident of Canadian Customs going bananas over a Sikh guy who had barely-clothed pics of his young kids in his wallet. Now thats culturally ok in India/asia, and does NOT mean pedophilia (just like two men holding hands in India does NOT make them gay).
The west needs to grow up.
I think Gandhi said it best when he said that the civilization of the west was a good idea.
retorts — I kinda agree; my original statement said policy has some role, in addition to the nature and circumstances of immigration into Canada. But that there is stated policy does affect mindset — both in terms of what’s taught in school, and how things are discussed in the public domain. There are similarities with the US, of course, but in Canada’s case the existence of offical policy has played some role in how things have played out. Also, note, that Canada takes in a higher number of immigrants as a percentage of population (ie: immigration rate) than any other country.
rax – yes, they didn’t do that great a job initially on ensuring immigrants could get jobs appropriate to their qualifications. this is being fixed, or so I hear. however, it’s pretty absurd nowadays for an immigrant not to get some well-paying job; as long as they go to Alberta. The economy there is insane and electricians, truck drivers, etc. can make well over $100k. That being said, Canadians still have among the most positive attitudes towards immigration anywhere (even as they take in the most per capita) — that’s something unique, and at least one place where official multiculturalism policy being put forth in the classroom has possibly helped.
I think Gandhi said it best when he said that the civilization of the west was a good idea.
totally, people in india are sssooo accepting of heterodox behavior. it isn’t like there are norms and expectations which people in india are supposed to follow!
The immigrants (1st gen) from ANY race, sex, religion, nation will go through GREAT struggle in wherever they go in the West- that has ALWAYS been a given! Desis need to stop complaining and work on themselves b/c the “society” CANNOT always be to blame. There is always someone around to help you out w/ learning things in a new country- just look and ask. Share things w/ others- they may have some immigrant stories in their recent past, too.
Also, DO NOT go somewhere w/o a guarantee of a good job (or one that you can handle, if not prestigious)!!! I learned this the hard way, and I only moved states!
Since it was mentioned that she worked various jobs, I wonder if she understood or had enough exposure to the local customs, expressions etc. It looks like one of her former jobs was an airport security guard. Was that job also in Canada and what did it involve? Are the Canadian airport secuity people trained to look for threats in any form? At least in the US airports, any sort of reference, joke, hint, limerick, (or whatever) about killling/bombs/terrorists is a red flag.
Its not about who is accepting or not accepting heterodox behaviour. Its about what you do when heterodox behaviour occurs, as it does, in multi cultural places.
Its about learning to grow up and to realize that you live in a culturally diverse world. Stop freaking out. Stop treating people as criminals first. If they do something out of the ordinary, give them the benefit of doubt. And frankly, stop demanding “If they’re coming to our country, they should learn to speak in English!”. Get over yourselves!
Sending a person (who claimed to love gulab-jamun,) a packet of anthrax-like white-powder called “gulab-jamun mix” doesn’t freak them out in India (or most of the world). It is considered thoughtful.
It was my belief till a few hours ago that in the west, if someone told me they liked chocolate brownies, and I baked them some, it would be considered thoughtful too. Well, not if I’m going to go to jail for it! Oh no! I’m not making brownies for nobody! (Side thought : Brownies = yumm; Brownie = racial slur?! wtf)
Incidents like these cause more racial segregation. And to the person who commented “Share things w/ others” : No Thankyou Ma’am. Thats how this woman got into trouble. Lets all stay in our groups and cliques and keep interaction to the minimum.
About the killing bit: My german/euro biz manager says “die! die! die!” if I tell him that IT wont be delivering something he needed last week. The first time he IMed those words, it was a bit weird, but it is quite apparent that it was in jest (i hope).
Just last week I told my friend “I’m gonna kill you when we get home”, because he called me a slut at a bar. Thankfully my friends are not in high places, and sane enough to realize a statement like “I’d tell you but then I’d have to kill you” doesn’t literally mean what it says.
The west needs to import some sense of humor from asia/europe. The east needs to import some sense of superiority(or atleast equality) and self-entitlement thats abundant in the west.
If I say I like brownies (is that code for a desi fetish?), I expect brownies, not some crappy old aunt Jemima mix (that’s not racist, I hope). I’d be pissed too if you gave me some $2 mix past its expiry date, and tried to palm it off as a favor.
No, it’s a competence slur.
What, you consider gulab jamun powder anthrax-like? I assume that’s your opinion, because I didn’t see anybody else saying it, not least the premier and the law. And, sending them over 200 emails and threatening repercussions if said powder doesn’t reach guinty as charged, that’s a little too thoughtful for most people.
Considering the “stalky” nature of wooing in India, maybe she just has a crush on Dalton.