Periodically, we see stories about how folks in India involved in the global economy are taking accent classes to work on their English accents. Thomas Friedman wrote about the accent training many call-center workers undergo in The World is Flat. And today there was a typically fluffy piece in The Times of India about people who work on “regional” accent-training within India.
But it seems to me there hasn’t been enough coverage of accent problems that go the other way around. Watching Aliens in America the other night, it occurred to me that ABD actors and comedians who play immigrants in comic roles in Hollywood sometimes need their own accent training. You wouldn’t expect it, but most ABDs can’t really do a perfect Indian English accent. It’s either overdone (too musical), or inconsistent (those American ‘D’ and ‘T’ sounds creep in at telltale moments, as do those flat American ‘A’ and ‘E’ sounds) — or both. Adhir Kalyan doesn’t have many obvious flaws, though in my view something isn’t quite right with his accent (check it out at 1:45-2:00 in this clip). Kal Penn’s “Taj Mahal Badalandabad” character in Van Wilder has an accent that I find more convincing (see this clip), and it becomes funny when he says things that are particularly obscene or outrageous (as he does in that somewhat NSFW clip). And Russel Peters is quite good — accents are his particular strength. But there’s a host of lesser-known actors and stand-up comedians in parentally-financed movies like American Desi (and its various clones and imitations), who sound like they learned their Indian accents from Apu on The Simpsons, rather than real Indians.
Somehow Brit-Asian actors don’t seem to have this problem. The accents on Goodness Gracious Me and The Kumars at No. 42 always sound perfect to me. Why is that?
At any rate, I’m hereby calling for an accent-accentuation school for aspiring ABD actors and comedians trying to get a break in Hollywood. The staff, incidentally, will be entirely composed of Indian call center workers fired because their accents were too thick (or indeed, too regional). Classes will be held exclusively via videoconference (the instructors, of course, will all be based in India).
BIGirl: I will say one more time – there is no such language called GUJURATI. The language spoken in the state of GUJARAT is called GUJARATI. Everyone got that? I am sure people from Kerala would not like it if someone calls their language as Malloyam !! The debate on this thread reminds me of couplets from great Gujarati poet “Akhho”. It goes: Bhasha ne shu varge bhur Rann maa jite ae saacho shur. Loosely translated as: Clinging to the language is not important, the guy who wins in the battle, is the real brave one.
Reminds me of “TelUgu, not TelEgu“. 🙂
GUJURATI, GUJARATI. TELEGU, TELAGU. Tamil, Tamizh, tamizhl, tamizhlhzhlzhzlzhzl….tamilzhlsifhas/vfa/lsugfa**q?
the V pronounciation controversy(check at 1:19 into the clip) makes it all the way to the big screen 😉
@ 89:
my parents are both in the teaching field (my mum’s a speech pathologist), and despite being in Texas for almost 30 years, I frequently catch them saying “GRA-choo-ity” for “graTUity.”
i vill tell you.
ABD/ DBD differences: Perimeter Thermometer Certificate
@95;
Ernagulam?……….I have never heard a malayalee say that…..it is always been “Eranakulam”. BTW my mom’s house is not too far from there- Mulakulam :-).
However..I have heard pseudo mumbayites say “Mayheem” for “Mahim” and “Kayleey-ann” for “Kalyan”.
do abd’s accent differ from the surrounding american accent?
Puli, oh, ABD accents do vary. You got the Shymalan/30 Rock secretary guy slighty nasal accent common to quite a few. Hopefully the Ramesh Ponnuru wimpy accent is not as common. Mine is a hybrid as I lived in the north, south, and India. Sanjay Gupta represents another type of voice/accent(i guess I am including vocal texture here too as it seems to affect the accent a little bit).
By the way, I think KERPAL is great. The Kerpal joke is old, but I do think Kerpal(who must be some ABD) does a great impression of an angry DBD who is a little loco.
@109:
I find it slightly different…..can’t exactly say what it is, I am not a sound expert, it may be a little pitchy.
isnt that the jerky boys?
When talking to my relatives, I find myself pulling a fob-cent… not quite an accent, but I drop a lot of articles and just generally speak in short, clipped sentences and use “fob” grammar. Actually, I find myself using the fob-cent around anyone who’s not a native English speaker… I dunno if I’m trying to make it easier for them or just adapting to their way of speaking.
Also, in middle school I used to say eu-ROPE-ee-yen and protest-ant… till I got made fun of for it :\
TelUgu not TelAgu or TelEgu! 🙂
The worst accent ever is an Indian immigrant trying to sound American (in order to fit in better with Americans). I have a cousin who does this. I keep telling him it sounds horrible…but he can’t see it. His orginal accent is so much more classy.
Does anyone else out there switch accents? I came to the US when I was six, and I speak in an Indian accent with others who speak in an accent which sounds remotely like it comes from the subcontinent, and in an American accent with everyone else. In mixed company I get completely discombobulated.
Yeah, I do that too..I am DBD as well..people @ work have commented that I have no accent around them but develop a very strong accent as soon as I pick up the phone to talk to my husband..I smile and tell them its actually the other way around, I talk to my husband in my natural lilt, while have a differect accent when I talk to them. I used to be able to switch it off and on, not so much any more, they both seem to run together now..except when I catching up with my old college buddies back in Bombay, when my Bombay accent comes bounding back in full vigor 🙂
RE: ABD Accents.
Well, I’ve noticed that some ABDs have a slight Indian accent–the kind that you can pick up when you speak to them on the phone–they have a slightly different voice quality. I wonder if that is physiological thing? Or is it because ABDs grew up around DBD parents who have accents? I have no idea.
In any case, I do speak Hindi with a slight American accent and tend to speak more Henglish instead of pure, proper Hindi. Sad, but true. Another thing I have trouble with in Hindi is that I always use the formal “aap” form, and have trouble using the informal “Tu” form, because when I was growing up, I was only around adults and never got to use the “Tu” form.
Puli, I think it has been misattributed to the Jerky Boys. Maybe because of the Indian guy.
ptr_vivek, I am the opposite. I was born here, but lived in India for a little while later. So my accent changes too.
having a seperate accent for your spouse is cool.
Regarding Ramamurthy’s accent on Heroes, I had read that they focus-grouped the first episode and people preferred the British accent to the Indian one, so the producers told him to change it. Now, whether that’s because people aren’t comfortable with an Indian accent generally, or Ramamurthy’s particular accent, it’s hard to say. Leaving accuracy aside for a moment, he really did sound more at ease with the British accent IMHO.
Speakin of desi actors….just caught Kal Penn on House, minus any lame accent though
He got the best parts of the episode. The thing with the defibrillator was a total House move.
Talking about his accent on house- it did not seem to be his “real” accent. Looked like he was trying to put more bass in to his voice to sound more authoritative, being a doctor and all.
YO DAD, I didn’t mean to offend you. In fact I am GujArati, but it’s just an old habit and also a result of typing fast. Budhu buraber che?
122 BIGirl:
Edit: Gujjews speak Hebrew 😉
Did anyone catch Pranab Mukerjee and the CEO of Infosys On Charlie Rose last night? I think Charlie’s compiler had to be running overtime 🙂
Absolutely not!!! Are you implying that Indians, whether ABD or DBD, have a tendency towards an Indian accent because the structural aspects of our vocal apparatus are different than other humans???
The answer is no…we all (humans) have the same physiology…accent is a result of environment and surroundings. If some ABDs have a slight Indian twinge to their accent (I’m one of them by the way) then that’s because of the various complex SOCIAL factors that people have been discussing throughout this thread.
My boss does that. He is Canadian born ABD (I guess CBD, then), and his accent changes when he talks to DBDs. He even pronounces his name different.
That’s not uncommon among DBD’s too. I’m Bombay born and bred and we mix Hindi, English and Marathi at home. I haven’t seen anyone speak pure, pure Hindi in my life. For example, we say “driver” not “vahan-chalak”. I don;t even know what the Hindi words for common words like “bus”, “train”, “school”, “telephone”, “tv” etc are. I suspect my speech has more Hindi than yours, and I speak with a Desi accent, but barring the accent you will probably feel right at home in Bombay
Regarding. “aap” and “Tu”, many people are of the opinion that “Tu” should only be used while insulting someone. In my family, everyone calls each other “aap”. We use “Tu” only when we are being informal. Me and my brother call each other “Tu”, though, because we are used to being informal.
Well, you should hear the babel that my 2 sisters and I talk in, with each other only : its an unique amalgam of Bombaiya Hindi(think Munnabhai), Marathi, Brahminical Tamil and English..its horrendous and beautiful @ the same time, the breadth and scope of the vocabulary is beyond parallel and its awesome when all we have to do is for one of us to say one particular phrase, and the other 2 know exactly what she is talking about and go into peals of laughter. This is subject to much eye-rolling from our ABD kids and much confused bewilderment from our hubbies who speak real Hindi, Tamil & English but cannot understand a word of this particular patois that is unique to where we grew up, its awesome, our little language of our own..come to think of it, its really cool to have 2 sisters to share this with as well 🙂
Hey, I will tell you what the Telugu words are: Bussu, Trainu, Schoolu, Phonu, TVu
For TV it’s TVBV, no matter where in India you are from 😛
What i find interesting is this one word that grates me when spoke in the 2 accents-
Executive in the UK it’s pronounced it as in ‘ex-eh-cu-tive’
but DBDs pronounce it ‘exe-cuuuuutiv’
not sure if this translates well via email, but when spoken the second version defeinetly sounds different.
I do like the fact the vocab in India is same as UK, makes life easy.
@dr1001
another one – perimeter
took me forever to change from pe-ree-me-ter to peri-miter
and yes I switch accents too…are there any ME/DXB raised DBDs on sepia? depending on which school we attended out there…we had an accent too.
122 Khharaab Bhartiya Chhokri: Baddhuu barabar chhe beti – chinta naaa karish !
I do not know about Hindi but in Gujarati: Bus = Collegian Khhataro (go figure), Train = Agnirath, School = Paathshaara, Telephone = Doorvaani, TV = Doordarshan. For further consultation contact “Bhadambhadra” – a fictional fellow from the 1950s novel.
Read that BHADRAMBHADRA !! Gujjews are baaaaad at spelling anyway. Ask Abhi if you don’t believe me.
Pagla,
I’m glad that I’m not the only one who makes that mistake. I always feel very sheepish about it. When I went to visit my relatives in Delhi a few years ago, I was talking to my little cousin. He is about 7 years younger than me. And I couldn’t stop using “Aap” with him, and he rather politely told me to switch to the “Tu” form, since we are family, but I just couldn’t manage it. LOL. When I was younger, I was taught that you should use Tu/Tum with peers that you know well, and with people much younger than you (i.e. if you are an adult, you should use Tum with kids).
As for fitting in well in Bombay, I hope so! I’ve always wanted to visit Bombay, as many of my DBD friends are from that city, and they always tell me fascinating things about it.
Amitabh,
A few years ago, we were discussing accents in one of my college classes. The professor said that he felt that sometimes people sound different and have a different voice-tone quality because their noses are shaped a bit differently. He mentioned that he knew East-Asians who had a slight accent even though they were adopted and lived in an American environment.
I thought this was a bit strange and wondered if there was any validity to that statement. So that’s why I mentioned it on this post.
You are probably MORE likely to be correct; that people’s accents are the result of social factors.
Ahhh… this thread brings back fond memories of me pronouncing words wrong for years thanks to mummy-daddy. To this day they still say things like “dev-lop-ment” rather than “de-vel-op-ment.” And my dad’s guju accent doesn’t allow him to say the “sh” sound which is always fun since we live on “Ashbrooke drive…” [ass-brook, for the slow ones].
As an ABD who CAN do an Indian accent (and not just generic, but regional), I’m amazed at how many can’t. It’s all around me, how can I not pick it up? Then again, I have a thing for languages in general. I can even do the advanced move of an Indian person trying to do an American accent (like the TV hosts)!
pravin@128
hee-hee.
i was trying to learn the colors in kutchi and the consensus came to be blue = be-lew
I noticed DBDs tend to use the word paining more frequently than hurting. That’s why I had to laugh when I watched Mississippi Masala and the bride goes “you’re paaiiiinnning me”
no reason any longer to say “i don’t know the hindi words”. languages evolve, it is just that many indian languages are picking up several foreign words. bus and train are modern concepts, it is perfectly legitimate to use bus and train in hindi as well. school is shala, and both are widely used. telephone is one word where the hindi equivalent is probably more common—doorvani. tv is not even a “word” in english :)—notice how the longer form is on its way out?
it is not the prerogative of english to pick up foreign words—-after all, a big part of english is the romance languages. and english is “badly integrated” as well—and that is part of the reason for english to be so horrendously unstructured in spelling compared with many other languages. unlike indian languages, there is even no reason behind the alphabet ordering “ab..” other than the semetic/greek roots. but who cares? it is only the power of expression that counts.
no need to call it hinglish or anything, it is just hindi picking up new words. i think it is time to update dictionaries—i don’t think it is the death of indian languages as many believe when they see the new words. but rather i think it is a new phase of life for them.
What about shanti?
My mom has the opposite issue. She always mispronounces Yosemite. She says Yo-sho-meh-tee instead of Yo-semit-e. She always throws that “sh” in there and a bunch of her friends do it too…
Doesn’t Jodie Foster throw in sh for s all the time?
She is probably Welsh like Sean Connery, unrelated note, does this talk of your parents’ accent sound disrespectful to anyone? May be I am old school but I don’t ever think of my parents’ accents worthy of mocking.
Only way to prove or disprove it is by checking the accents of Desi kids were adopted by non desi families. I remember there was a post about a few minnestoa raised kids who were from Bengal. Would they have a Desi flavour?
It is only after coming to Australia that I can distinguish between various ancestries. Aussies of Italian/ Lebanese / Vietnamese / Chinese and Irish backgrounds sound different. Even when they switch to the aussie ocker, the flavours remain. One can pick this over the phone rather easily. American accented English as spoken in the Godfather is very similar to the Australian accented English as spoken by persons of a Italian heritage. Currently, we have heaps of American consultants on assignment and when it is pointed out that they have an accent and hence need to talk slowly, it does not go down too well 🙂
The pity is that the mocking comes from people who dont realize how hard it is to learn a new accent once you are an adult.
blockquote>The pity is that the mocking comes from people who dont realize how hard it is to learn a new accent once you are an adult.
We are not mocking anyone. We are just sharing stories of how our parents accents affected us and for the DBDs that have posted, their own issues with accents and pronunciation. Earlier I commented on how my GujArati is not that great. I know first hand how hard it is to learn an accent as an adult.
At the risk of being non-PC, simple empirical observations indicate otherwise to me. Its not about accent, its about voice quality.
Is there actually any data on this?
cookiebrown – i think the same, as well, though i have no easily disseminable data to show it. i did, however, start thinking about this when i saw the results of a research project on this very topic – and ever since then, i always keep an eye out when asians – east or otherwise – speak. it was surprising how many voices were (blindly) recognizable as asian, even if they had an ‘authentic’ american accent.
what do you mean by ‘voice quality’? Pitch? Timbre? Tone? I was actually under the impression that ABDs might have a leg up on everyone else, when it comes to imitating stereotypical DBD accents because of all the time they spent with a parent(s) that may have spoken accented english of the kind they wish to emulate in performance.
I think that without some sort of environmental/nurture-based factor, being able to do an ‘authentic’ accent is not magically the province of ABDs. It is also possible to switch–I can do hick, conversational, non slangified queen’s english for the SL dinner party and many others.
First week at my previous job, I went out to Taco bell with my Guju boss. After we got our lunch, he suddenly remarked in Hindi “Mother-in-law is good”. You see he was making a comment about the sauce but he said saas.
One of my friends would pronounce cheese as cheech. Why? So the listener doesn’t get confused between Cheez (which means thing in Hindi) and Cheese. Who can argue with that logic?
I have been a profesional Voice Over Artist for fifteen years now and have done ever genre of Voice over including on camera work. I have also been a voice Coach for almost ten years and help people overcome their Regional accents and pronunciation while speaking English. We work towards a neutral accent that is accepted world wide.
Besides the different accents, Indians from every region have an execess of, or a lack of certain sounds in their pronuncition. One of my tasks is help them aquire these sounds at acceptable levels