An anonymous tipster alerted us via the News tab to a possible racist/scandalous/nebulous slip of Michael Moore’s tongue. I sat through the entire, excruciating 10+ minute video at Breitbart.tv, only to discover that the controversial part is at the end; the video I posted below features the last eleven seconds of the entire segment and contains the relevant moment.
Link: sevenload.com
Well? What do you think? Racist or immature? Mispronounced or intentionally mangled? Or is this much ado about nothing? Comments on Breitbart were hot, heated and divided about whether or not Michael Moore started to channel Apu. What say you?
I’m surprised that Moore can say anything right when he’s about to pop a blood vessel over yet another argument.
I used to get bothered by such things, but now it doesnt bother me. I just liken it to someone calling african americans black. So Indian could be used in a racial context rather than a nationality one, kind of like Hispanic.
For those who are reading challenged:
Anna didn’t find this story on her own, one of you submitted it.
For the record, she does not find it racist. See:
Jimi: your “wtf, Anna” was totally unnecessary. The post is posing a simple question. An
“I agree he did” or “No, he didn’t slur”
will suffice; no need to attack the blogger.
I agree with you here, sigh!. The “dark side” seems to have Limbaugh, Coulter, Dobbs, and Robertson who will instigate and provoke on their behalf. And then you have the news media which is influenced by commercial and political lobbies behind the scenes. So I will gladly stomach Moore’s shrill demagoguery, Gore’s preachiness, and Huffington’s ceaseless self-promotion for whatever firepower they can provide to the joke that is “left of center.” No one’s perfect.
A non-story.
Fascinating to see insecurity of the author and crowd though – as if there is an extra defense field to attack anyone who slightly mispronounces the name or dares to call someone Indian because that person is of Indian origin. Really – aren’t we all being extra sensitive here to attack those whom we perceive are “against us”?
Perhaps the one who complained about labelling Gupta as “Indian” may have been happier if he was labelled as “South Asian”?
sigh! and portmanteau, I agree with both of you that Moore’s movies are far superior to the moronic monoculture of the “mainstream media”, but what kind of bar is that? I vote with my feet on that point of view though – I don’t watch TV (at all), but will definitely watch Sicko (as well as other Moore movies). But that’s no reason to give him a free pass on his clear selective disclosure of facts.
I think Moore does a great job to create visibility around very important problems. The major issues I have with him are that I think his solutions are half-baked at best, and his fact-picking and penchant for rabble rousing can lead people to discard even the good parts of his argument. And that’s a disservice.
Michael Moore has as much subtlety as a steam roller but I’m glad he’s around.
I saw Sicko with a former health insurance VP who often spent time trying get valid claims through the system for friends/family in dire straits.
As for my own bill sorting mentioned above, I made sure to act politely on all of my phone calls to billing departments. This resulted in spending a long phone call listening to/soothing an operator who had worked at various hospital jobs for the past 15 years but was breaking down in the billing department. She was stressed out all the time from people yelling at her b/c their health insurance companies wouldn’t cover costs. . . (my main main problem was the insurance company doing 1st round denials . . .)
(ok, I’m signing off of the Moore comment topic–on to more relevant topics . . .)
“slighty off-topic but who checked out M. Night on Entourage this week..”
Hhahaha… CAA is getting Night the Primo gigs….UTA might as well close up shop 🙂
Perhaps you missed my last comment or the first sentence of this post. The author? Initiating a discussion is insecure?
For some of you, your hurry to be blase and dismiss the “crowd” is such that you completely ignore the majority of comments on the thread you are so eager to join, which think this is NOT an issue.
I found it much more offensive when Michael J. Fox (playing some character I’ve forgotten) yelled “Gewpta!!” at a waiter character.
chachaji’s right– Dr. Sanjay says Gewpta himnself. Michael Moore was just shouting.
Now Sanjaya….Sanjaya, who makes people say Malakar correctly, which is a lot harder and is another reason I’m a Fanjaya, had a snappy answer to a stupid question– a reporter asked him, what’s the one hair-care product that you can’t live without?
He said: Water.
I wonder if one reason Sanjaya does say those kinds of things, might be because his friends support him and he knows how whack the subtext is of a lot of what comes his way. I just am assuming he has a multi-ethnic group of friends being in Seattle and with his age and all. I would think that knowledge is a big help in dealing with things
Of all of the wrong things that Michael Moore said on Wolf Blitzer yesterday, overenunciating “Gupta” was the least of it. (And I support universal healthcare!) For all we know, it’s a Michigan accent.
jeet, what facts was he wrong about on Blitzer? I’m curious. (Apart from the fact that he says Fahrenheit 9/11 proves that he was completely right about the Iraq war. He seems to have forgotten the entire conspiracy theory, army recruiting etc. parts of his own movie. Wolf Blitzer also says that CNN tried to get Moore multiple times in the 3 years since he was last on, but he never showed. I assume he’s not lying about that, since Moore didn’t contradict him. That doesn’t absolve CNN of the things Moore accuses them of about the Iraq war though).
If 90% of the people made this pronunciation, it would not be a big deal. Moore holds himself up as some sort of paragon of liberalism and enlightenment. That’s why it’s worth questioning whether this was racist.
I watched like 5 minutes of the Blitzer interview but couldn’t watch anymore after the 20th time he asked for an apology from Wolf. Some ego Moore has. There’s some families who have lost children, husbands, wives, brothers, and sisters, and Moore wants an apology for himself.
I actually am a liberal. I just find Moore’s arguments lacking in subtlety. There’s been much better political documentaries in the last few years, including The Corporation, An Inconvenient Truth, Gunner Palace, Fog of War etc.
Rahul writes:
This is a characterstic that’s common to not just those from the left/liberal but also from those who are from the right/conservative.
The liberal/left correctly points out problems regarding healthcare/GlobalWarming/immigration/economy etc, but their solutions (socialized medicine/Carbon emission restrictions/Amnesity/Higher Taxes) worsen the problem, not to mention create a few new problems (poverty, increased crime etc) in the process.
The conservative/right correctly points out problems regarding terrorism/moral values/Social Security/immigration etc, but their solutions too (wanton war/privatization of SS/wall building) worsen the problem and create new problems (death/destruction, hatred for America, corruption, waste of tax dollars) in the process.
If only Ron Paul could get elected…
M. Nam
Those are his websites. It’s still just him. Yes I know he’s overweight, but he’s still just a single person. It’s not a system, and propaganda implies a systematic spreading of ideas, so eloquently stated in websters.
You learn something new every day.
HMF, are you saying individuals are definitionally incapable of engaging in propaganda? (Also, were you looking at a different Webster’s page, because mine doesn’t say systematic). In any case, systematic can very well mean “following a system”, individuals can be systematic too. Alright, enough with the EBL 🙂
As for the link you sent me, so the Heritage Foundation (which is different than the Pentagon. Just because you sleep with somebody doesn’t mean you are them) discusses terrorism with the 24 team. Sure, they need something to feed their often wild fantasies, right? Who better than a colorful right wing creative type?
I don’t know why the anonymous tipper thought this was worth watching, to be upset by this is a little too al sharpton-esque for me…when the PC filters are turned up so high…how does one hear the actual message?
In fact, if there’s any propagandizing going on, it’s the categorization of Michael Moore’s films as propaganda.
I’m actually very glad this discussion is happening, because it’s reassuring to see so many people who are on the same page about how to interpret such instances and what to prioritize.
As individuals, yes, that’s what I’m saying. But more so than engaging, they are incapable of producing it. But they are capable of participating it, if it’s done at a group level.
It wasn’t miriam websters definition I was looking at, my bad, it was this one.
“But more so than engaging, they are incapable of producing it…”
That’s a crucial, subtle point.
This is a hopeless rathole. Many propagandizing elements – advertisements, pamphlets, movies, etc. – are indeed produced by individuals. So, in any case, since that’s not the discussion I want to have, I will say that Moore engages in propaganda with his movies, if it makes you happier 🙂
Michael Moore said nothing racist; angry- yes, racist- NO. I’d be angry too. Dr. Gupta needs to get his facts straight, he “fudged” the fudging of Sicko. Gupta said Moore claimed Cuba pays $25 per person in health care costs when Moore clearly stated in his movie that they pay $251. Talk about shoddy journalism! Unfortunately, Gupta came off as an incompetent sellout.
uh, I’m not saying that a group of people have to run over to the printing press and simultaneously push the on button for it to be propaganda. A single individual can participate in propaganda, but for something to truly be propaganda, it cannot be so readily identifiable as such. It’s counterintuitive, but that’s the nature of the beast.
Moore cannot engage in propaganda with his movies, if he’s the sole, at the very least, a minority voice.
Why are people on the left so eager to dismiss Moore but willing to give a free pass to Beinart and Co.?
ah, but don’t you have to be somewhat of a sell-out to appear regularly on a cable news outfit that’s still chasing (and in some ways aping) fox news for ratings?
If Gupta hadn’t parroted the party line on Moore (he fudges facts–he might be unreliable–he’s far left, we’re in the sensible center) would his editor have let him even have a segment at all?
This was not racism. This was merely Guptarism.
Shodan, if we were discussing Beinart, I’d come down hard on him too. I gave up on Beinart like 5 years ago. At least, Moore is half right.
Also, Moore has a bully pulpit unlike Beinart. I don’t think TNR counts 🙂
Rahul and HMF would you agree on calling it “agitprop”?
agitprop: short for “agitation-propaganda,” a form of drama that incites the emotions (“agitation”) and then teaches social and political lessons to encourage the audience to engage in a particular political action. Clifford Odets’s play Waiting for Lefty and the actos of Luis Valdez are agitprop.
The full factual backup is here
Agitation AND propaganda? What’s not to like?
If you close your eyes, dial up the volume, and listen hard, after hitting your head on the wall a dozen times, you can hear him say macaca… Developing…
my thinking exactly.
Macacas , please don’t play race card too much, it will back fire. If you live in this land, be ready for any work of yours in public domain to be scrutinized , ridiculed and thrashed. If a brown reporter’s work can’t be judged , then a brown musician can’t be critiqued, a brown professer’s paper can’t be reviewd and a brown actor’s talent can’t be questioned. Don’t claim immunity using the color of your skin.
You should go see your doctor, hopefully it’s covered.
Michael Mooore is an ingnorant, self-loathing, America hating bore. No one should pay any attention to anything he says, even when he mocks an American doctor of Indian origin.
I should do it before the next election then, when it would be covered, but I’d have to wait a brazillion hours. So i’d bang my head on the wall again, and fall into a vicious cycle of head banging and waiting. all those people who insist on universal coverage, why do you hate my head?
Yes Michael Moore’s films can be considered propaganda…but thank goodness he’s around to spread many truths that are often ignored in the mainstream media.
A hearty muhaha to that. Although Senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations, frequent contributions to WaPo and Time, books by the wazoo — that shit counts. How come he didn’t get his clown cap yet? Moore screwed up on details. Beinart got the whole thing completely and spectacularly wrong.
Also for those keeping score, I vote for No he didn’t.
Because when it comes to choosing whether a 2 year old lives or dies because only a certain in network HMO hospital will treat her – or your lumpy head getting a bit lumpier, call my sympathetic I chose the former.
What truths Shalu ????
Yes! But, here’s the one solitary essay of Beinart’s which I agree with.
My favorite econ blogger believes that the WaPo will be dead in five years, unless they get some serious overhaul done. I don’t have an opinion on that, but they feature quite frequently in his journamanals (warning: might do bad things to your firefox, at least on linux). In fact, the top entry in his blog seems to be a WaPo edition of journamalism.
He’s such an insignificant, ingnorant, bore, yet you felt it necessary to visit all the way from your hole to bless us with that information, and to warn us. How thoughtful.
Your’e welcome HMF. I seems that information was strangely missing here.
Please!
Whoever took offense at this must really be desperate to be offended.
How sad to go through life fishing for oppurtunities to be offended.
Ever heard of the “secret”? The Laws of Attraction? You will draw into your life that which you are looking to draw either consciously, sub-consciously or un-consciously.
I didn’t read all the comments, so apologies in advance. It wasn’t racist. I’d much rather talk about universal health care than Michael Moore sputtering because he was so angry. This vid seems like much ado about nothing.
Rahul, I have the same level of discomfort with Moore. I liked Bowling for Columbine, but he seems to shoot himself in the foot a little. He brings up great issues, introduces really compelling and indicative individual narratives, but then he blows it all on a rant or by using numbers/studies that are also a bit suspect. I’d rather he do something solid all around. His biggest contribution, though, is in breaking down these issues in a way that is digestible, understandable, and relevant to the average American.
HMF, with all that head banging I’m beginning to see your point. spending my money on saving two year old > spending my money on my head injury. yes, yes. headbang Wait, I’m also seeing that taking away your money to eat out, and live in more than a one room apt, and spending it on my head injury is also necessary. headbang Wait, my money has better marginal utility being spent on starving africans.
Yes, yes, frankly, I think we should all be taxed 60% plus like France, no wait, more like 80%, and allow it to flow where there are greater marginal utilities.
Thanks HMF.
Yes, while he does tend to portray only one side of an issue, it’s often a side that gets very little coverage.
Michael Moore for president!