Last week, a Sikh in New Zealand got on a Qantas flight from Queenstown to Auckland. You can guess what happened next … he got kicked off because the other passengers didn’t want him flying with them.
“People either side of me were saying they don’t want me on here … One of the ladies told another guy ‘I’m not comfortable with him on this plane’,” Mavi says. “She was talking to a whole group. The lady started it and then somebody went and spoke to the captain. The Qantas man requested me and said ‘You’re not allowed to travel in this plane because the passengers are not happy’…” [Link]
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p>I hadn’t realized that commercial flights were like survivor, that the passengers are polled and one unlucky one is voted off. Silly me, I thought you paid, you got checked out by security, and you disembarked at your destination. Things seem to be a bit … different on the other side of the world.
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p>Of course, Qantas has a different account of what happened. They say simply that:
A Qantas Airways spokesman from Sydney [said] … the passenger “displayed behaviour prior to boarding and on board before departure which concerned our staff”. After “careful consideration” a decision was made to offload the passenger. [Link]
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p>What behavior was this? Simple – he went to the bathroom. [He was fixing his turban, but that’s irrelevant to the story] Was that threatening? Here’s what another passenger had to say:
A Queenstowner on board recalls the flight attendant knocking on the toilet door “quite loud” and asking Mavi to return to his seat. “I remember thinking it was strange, the attendant’s urgency, when the front door of the plane was still open. He kept knocking. I thought, Give him a chance to pull his pants up,” the passenger says…. “Never did I think for a second that he was a threat.” [Link]
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p>Remind me to eat lots of fiber before I board a flight next time. Sheesh.
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p>An Australian lawyer friend of mine tells me that this was probably an illegal act on Qantas’ part. Here’s my suggestion – the next time a Qantas air host or hostess decides to break the rules, maybe it should be for something like this. As for me, unless I see an abject apology, I’m afraid I’m not going to fly Qantas in the future.
Related posts: Down Under Desis, First Desi Viceroy of Kiwistan, Rage Down Under,
I’m so not surprised by this. The day after September 11 a Sikh gurdwara in Hawke’s Bay (where I used to live) was graffitied with such fragrant blossoms of human expression as ‘fucken terrorists’ etc.
I feel terrible for him…but I doubt anything will happen. As a West Indian lecturer of mine said, some of us are the ‘wrong kind of blacks for this country.’
If a Maori or Polynesian person had something like this happen to them it would be on the headlines. But this story was just a minor blip on the news radar in a country filled with headlines of overly woolly sheep and cats getting stuck in removal vans.
Thank you for highlighting the issue though. It’s sad that to find out the most information about a story from my own country I had to turn to an American website!
I’m afraid I’m not going to fly Qantas in the future.
I made that decision when they charged me excess baggage for 1 kg, while Singapore let me off with 8. Their ground staff is not friendly and cabin crew is only slightly better.
My original comment was going to be that the complaining passenger has to be a tourist because Queenstown is such a small town and everyone knows who Sikhs are because the owner of the Little India restaurant in Q’Town is a well-known sardar. When he’s not a restauranter, he also doubles as my favorite mamaji(!) and plays a couple other less meaningful roles like father, husband, citizen, Queenstown’s don daddy, etc. So I read the first story for more details and,
Rock on you studmuffin. And Mavi, keep ya head up son. Oh, by the way, this ain’t the first turban incident in New Zealand.
I only have good things to say about Air New Zealand. Qantas, not so much.
You a Kiwi, No Von Mises?
I’m not so sure about the complainant being a tourist. One well-known Sikh does not make a town less racist, and Queenstown with its overflow of wealthy Asian tourists spending up large and slightly resentful less-wealthy white locals, isn’t exactly a hotbed of racial tolerance.
Kia ora tash!
No ma’am. But I’ve been there a couple times and have loads of family there, all over north and south island.
What? How can this be? Impossible. Why I remember walking the mean streets of Q-town and overhearing a wealthy Asian tourist say, “Me? Racist? Never. I ate at an Indian restaurant yesterday. Served by Sikh man even.” And another time, I heard a less-wealthy white local say, “Cods wollop! Some of my best friends are
gnomesSikhs.”I say this, not them, tongue-in-cheek of course.
NVM – big ups to your mamaji. Anyone know how many desis there are in Kiwistan?
I wish Mr. Mavi’s story was a unique one, but it’s unfortunately one I read about/hear of too often.
BTW, you’ve got an email reply on the way, I’ve just been held up with studying and whatnot.
isnt it true that qantas has never crashed? i got this info from a very reliable source (Rainman)
looks like they got a rep to maintain 🙂
Kia ora koutou,
Thank for the link to the article – I’m curious and dismayed as to why this hasn’t come across even the alternative media outlets at home (NZ) … Certainly he should complain to the Human Rights Commission and his local MP because it will cause one hell of a fuss – I’m surprised that he hasn’t.
Tash: if it had happened to someone who was a Maori or Pacific Islander, sadly, you wouldn’t have heard about it at all, ever.
Aotearoa/New Zealand’s population is roughly 4.5 million (and because someone else is going to make the joke I’ll get in first, no that does not include the sheep, although at one stage our goverment was thinking of carbon taxes per cow). The census from 2001 has 60,213 people identifying themselves as ethinically Indian, 1,017 as Pakistani, 1,143 as Bangladeshi, 1,983 as Fijian Indian. I’m finding Stats NZ’s webpage a little difficult to navigate at the moment but suffice to say these numbers have grown a little since then.
The story is from last week. Back then I saw a shorter version of it on a lot of NZ websites, but this was the only long form of the story I could find. I thought it was worth sharing even if it was from a week ago, your reaction proves that my instincts were right.
So disturbing. We should all don turbans or naqib for a worldwide hour of protest.
Qantas PR should take a leaf out of BA’s handbook: BA passenger sits next to corpse or perhaps…
Survivor-esque choices? Not a problem. I HATE flying next to obese people as they spill over onto my seat with their sweaty arms. I HATE flying next to kids, who have to ask me where I live, what kind of chips I like, and if I want to play cards with them for the next 4.5 hours en route to New York, where their nana lives. I HATE flying next to the tired salesman, who thinks I am interested in hearing about hiw new wonder medical device, and how if I forward his info to 10 doctors, I get a free airfare trip for the contacts. I HATE flying next to the aspiring actress/model/songstress en route back to LA, who has to gush about her William Morris meetings, gig at the Viper Room, or how she will be America’s Next Top Idiot. I HATE flying next to the aunties in the salwar kameez, and notice I have no wedding ring, and talks about what a sin I am living under my parents roof as a single daughter for 2 hours, and afterwards spends the remaining time if I know “Surinder’s Chachi’s Brother-in-Law, who has a son, and if we drop you off, you can meet him.” And above all, I HATE flying next to the old woman, who brings out her grotesquely smelly pastrami with extra onions sandwich, making me nauseous the whole flight as I am a veg, and the putrid smell of carcass makes me ill.
Can I vote anyone of these types off since they, too, “make me feel uncomfortable?” I’ll try my next flight, and let you know…
Can I switch seats with you next time?
Amitabh, please do switch seats. Because, then I’ll be able to say how I HATE flying with passengers who need to switch seats to have real time in-flight entertainment, sit with their friends or girlfriends, and make me switch over to any of the above mentioned atrocities. 😉
sena x, Qantas’ last crash was in 1951. See http://www.planecrashinfo.com/Airline/AL%20Q-R.htm.
If you look on the same site, you will see that there are other Asian airliners with similar, if not better, safety records. Qantas has also had several non-fatal incidents in recent years.
Oh, QANTAS is notorious, but then Australia is not precisely noted for its ethnic inclusivity. A Tamil Hindu friend was held up for precisely four hours when he returned from his first trip home to Singapore after 9/11: he was minded to drop his pants and demonstrate categorically that he is no Muslim but on reflection he considered that stupid Australian Immigration police would have no idea of the significance and he’d certainly be deported on the spot.
(Of course we don’t mention the treatment that travellers with exotic headgear receive on Malaysian airlines — exotic headgear other than tudongs, that is.)
Jews and even so many Christians are also circumsized. I can’t believe anyone would be made to do that by an airlines. Couldn’t that be counted as sexual harrasement/abuse?
And if he was muslim so what? Can someone be detained or punished simply due to their religion?
Are the airlines doing this to African American men – many whom are muslims?
Ah, hiteracy. It’s such a CV-booster!
The original poster wrote,
This means, MoS, that he “was inclined to” or “thought about” dropping his pants. Not that anyone made him do it.
Assiniboine, who received what treatment on Malaysian airlines? I must’ve missed that story but I’m curious what it’s about — certainly any Malaysian would know that a Sikh isn’t a Muslim. Someone please fill me in.
Ennis,
I’m surprised that this is the first you are hearing of this practice. This has happened a few times now in the United States to Sikh and Muslim passengers. Right now I can only recall two people; Satnam Dhillon who was pulled off a plane in the S.F. Bay Area, and another passenger who was removed from American Airlines a while ago. I’m sure this happened quite a bit more than it was reported right after September 11th, and I’m sure it still continues today.
Oh, I know it’s happened plenty in the US. It’s the first time I’ve heard of it in NZ. I also haven’t heard of it happening much recently, in part because of the efforts of SALDEF and the Sikh Coalition.
I understand Qantas has a business to run and the “customer is always right” but if some people were uncomfortable flying with a Sikh, why didn’t they allow those people to disembark and put them on another flight? It makes no sense to disembark the Sikh…he wasn’t the one complaining!
That’s such a shame. I flew Qantas years ago (pre-9/11) and had a wonderful experience. I thought it was a really great airline. This incident, unfortunately, colors my view a bit.
Qantas is the lousiest airline my husband & I have ever flown. Their ground staff, cabin crew & call centre personnel vie with each other for the award of lousiest customer service. Perhaps it has something to do with their being headquartered in a country which we found was racially intolerant. The best service/value for your money is Emirates Airlines. Air New Zealand, as I recall, was rather average & perpetually delayed.
Singapore Airlines is good too. And anyone flying domestically in India should take Kingfisher…I tried it a few weeks ago and it was excellent.
I hate Osama Bin Laden and those 19 hijackers who action’s on 9/11, have made thing harder for many brown people after that day in the western countries.
Actually BA used to own 25% in Qantas
Qantas never had a fatal incident in the jet era, they have had fatalities before that.
Ennis,
Thanks for posting this. This incident really shows how ignorant (and stupid) some people are about different cultures.
I am going to be staying away from Qantas.
I just went to “Kiwistan” (that cracks me up… yea, i am new the site…gotta a problem?) last Dec/ Jan. I must say, I felt the people there are open to all cultures. I did not feel any tension whatsoever. Then again, it could be that I am a lighter shade of brown. Although, my fijian Indian friends can all leave fingerprints on charcoal. So, this whole turbanning incident is very surprising to me. I can say this after driving through many major towns in the North Island, as well as through many cities in the South Island including Queenstown. Btw, I had the best Aloo Chole’ in Queenstown… These India hillstation transfers can cook it up!! mmmmmm good.. And don’t let this incident turn you off of Queenstown. Its known as the adventure capital of the world, and it is the most beautiful place in the world in my opinion.
What pisses me off is that the complaining passengers treated Mavi as a non-person. I know there are couple of cases where people have got other people kicked off. But, I don’t recall any case where accusers have loudly talked around the accusee. This not only displays a lack of knowledge of alien cultures, but also displays a tremendous amount of disrespect for individuals of foreign culture.
Apparently this isn’t the first Sikh to get kicked off a flight in NZ. A friend was telling me about two rather priestly types who calmly took their kirpans on board. They walked through security and the metal detectors caught it. One of them was quite surprised that kirpans weren’t allowed on board…he’d been doing it for a year! I’m not surprised this wasn’t picked up by the media – I’ve lived in NZ for four years and I agree with Tash, Mavi was the wrong kind of minority. Even so, in my personal experience I’ve found that NZ is far more racially tolerant and aware of different cultures than most countries. Except when people ask me if I speak Indian. That’s just annoying.
I haven’t face such drastic behavior but I have seen the similar discriminatory experience on Heathrow airport (duty free shops).
What needs to be done the next time a passenger complains that they feel uneasy with another passenger being onboard – the Airlines should reply, “alright Madam/Sir, we will arrange for you to take the next flight out”, and have that person escorted off and onto another flight. I bet these silly complaints will stop in no time.
I can relate to Mavi’s experience in the sense of feeling embarrassed and intimadated by people around you in a foreign country so much so that it causes you to retreat rather than stand up for your rights and say something. But once you do that, people will more than likely be shocked and taken aback by your boldness, as well as disarmed if you are polite as well, and eventually they will respect you for that rather than treat you like a doormat that can be walked all over with no expectation of protest.
The incident reported did not tell the whole story, not that it makes the action any more justifiable. The Sikh man was taking on board the airplane his Kirpan. Naturally, through the lack of knowledge of the religion, the aircrew and passangers felt uncomfortable. In the post-September 11 world, any non-Western male taking on board a dagger of any description is viewed with suspicion and anxiety. Although there are many Sikhs in New Zealand, my being one of them, their is little knowledge of their cultural beliefs and practises. Sikhs, are often confused with Muslims as well…again through lack of understanding about this somewhat misunderstood segment of the Indian community. Racism, I feel, was not the real reason for the action at all.
New Zealand does have racism, sure. But it seems that people are engaging more with each other and are finding the ethnic diversity of our country a source of cultural richness. What we need is more knowledge about those cultural groups that are often ignored, all lumped into the ‘all Indians are Hindu’ basket.
Pumpkinlily – where did you get the information about the kirpan? I haven’t seen this on a single new story on this incident, and I’d read all the ones I could find.
Ummm — that sounds like racism to me. First, racism against muslims, and then “they all look alike” racism against Sikhs.
Hmm. I like this idea.
This story from yesterday said it was all about using the toilet during the period when the plane was on the ground. There is no mention of a kirpan here:
That’s terrible – and sad in its own way. Sikhs have been in NZ since 1890 – not only is that a long time in itself, it’s also somewhat longer than they’ve been in the US, Canada or Europe. Moreover, NZ itself was ‘settled’ by Europeans so much more recently than the US, Canada, even Oz – 1840s and later. So it’s really discouraging that even a long history of an ethno-religious group being settled somewhere – in this case, nearly as long as the European groups – gets you so little by way of local acceptance.
Also, one normally would associate such behavior with Europe or America – NZ is such a small, out-of-the way country (OK, that’s not PC – but it’s true) – I’ve often heard it described as the kind of place where ‘1950s American MidWestern good-natured friendliness’ still survives. This is why the incident is all the more disturbing.
Mitali, I like your idea…
As somebody who lives in a small Midwestern conurbation, I’ve got to say that even if such a thing ever existed, and if it was actually extended to outsiders, it’s now a myth. It’s pretty clear – some of my white colleagues talk about Midwestern friendliness, but none of my non-white colleagues do. Balderdash.
I see your point, Ennis – one of the reasons I put it in quotes. Even if the ‘1950s Midwestern friendliness’ was mythically constructed later – it could still exist someplace else! People who visited NZ described their experiences to me in those terms, but still, it needs the quotes.
Check out this link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/4879918.stm
Apparantly, being brown and liking the excellent music of the Clash are grounds for suspicion.
gm – have seen that story; truly ridiculous.
Sikhs were allowed to fly with their kirpans pre-9/11 in the U.S., so it is not really that “crazy” that people find it surprising that they can no longer fly that way. It has been a source of MAJOR public policy debate among the U.S. Sikh community (or at least the CA Sikh community).
pumpkinlilly, how is being “confused for being Muslim” not racist? Aside from assuming that all brown people are Muslim, your comment also implies that it is ok to discriminate against Muslims, and that such religious discrimination is not rooted in racial discrimination. I have not seen white Muslims thrown off a plane, but maybe I just haven’t looked hard enough.
MoS, I am with you – the person who is uncomfortable ought to deboard. I am so sick and tired of people’s latent racism being entertained and validated by all these “kick you off the plane” experiences.
Suspicion not only with authorities, but among fellow macacas as well. Check the SM thread on the subject.
london calling, hmmm. if it were sandinista, i would understand. but london calling? he should’ve had on rock the casbah, just to play it safe.
Actually, I think the huge popularity of ‘reality-shows’, where people get ‘voted off’ the group – has inspired and legitimated this kind of majoritarian behavior – in fact, if it is even that, not sure if there was a majority on the plane that wanted to kick him off. Why someone on a short-hop internal NZ flight would think something untoward could occur on their flight is beyond me.
Talking about the Midwest – once in the 1990s, I boarded a short-hop flight in the deep Midwest – barely a minute before they closed the doors, having arrived at the plane door breathless (from sprinting across the tarmac), and at the airport itself a mere two minutes earlier. Everybody took it in stride. The guy next to me chatted me up, made me feel absolutely at home, answered all my questions about that part of the Midwest, the bonhomie seemed real. It was the same in the hotel the previous night. Almost made me seriously consider moving from the East Coast to that part of the Midwest! It’s almost incredible when I think about it now, but it did happen.
Really we’re ‘1950s American MidWestern good-natured friendliness’? … um … ok … How about we’re just a really small country, and outside of the main centres, well ok, outside of Auckland and Wellington, you get some really small minded people who are hideously racist. And if anything NZ is going through a crisis of identity since the last election mostly sparked by the ‘foreshore and seabed’ debate along with a speech by the former leader of the opposition whose speech we’ll just refer to as ‘Orewa 1’ – it’s lead to a split between Pakeha (people of predominently European descent or white) and the minorities (and frankly we need to learn to stand together as one rather than pick on each other – which we do, a lot).
I’d love to explain what the above means, but I doubt many people would be interested, suffice to say, it’s an interesting time to discuss what is a New Zealander.
Obviously I’m going to defend the country of my birth, and yes there is racism (having been on the receiving end) aplenty as there is in many countries – my mum was the only person on our flight asked to take her sandals off in Perth, Australia and put them through the scanner (I in the meantime was wearing a Tino Rangatiratanga pin (flag of Maori Independence) and a black hoodie), she was also singled out for a search in L.A. while in transit, maybe ‘cos she was wearing a sari, I don’t know. Not that it makes it ok.
Okay, I know it’s an issue that is great to talk about, however I know I can do something about it (the advantage to being a New Zealander is that you’re about 3 degrees separation to most of the population including the heads of state) so if he’s not going to complain to the Race Relations Commissioner, part of the Human Rights Commission (and I hope he is making an issue about it beyond talking to media outlets), I will.
And you know, don’t fly Qantas in NZ, they are always delayed.
I’m interested. My best friend who is a half Desi/half Euro British citizen residing in USA is planning on moving to New Zealand because of it’s environment, beauty, open-mindedness and prime minister who is an anti-war vegetarian woman. She’s never been there but she only hears good things about it from people who have been and who live there. She thinks it will be a much better and more “holistic” place to raise her kids and progress as a spiritual musician than USA. Is she right or wrong?
It’s a great place to raise her kids. While we no longer have the, every home door is unlocked and every stranger is a nice person thing, it’s still pretty safe then most places. I think most New Zealanders who leave NZ come home to raise their kids. You can still play on the streets, be barefoot in the park, you still smile at your neighbours and strangers and yes, you will hear about every bit of crime that happens in NZ and a sheep who has been hiding in a cave for years unshorn … we’d like to have more news but we don’t. A lot of the time, the news is just embarrasing to watch.
The education system leaves a lot to be desired, but according to OECD figures we aren’t doing too badly. Not so good on teen suicides apparently, I think we have the highest rate in the world, there’s a dark side to the NZ psyche which can be evidenced in films like Heavenly Creatures, Scarfies and In My Father’s Den and come to think of it, it’s lurking in a lot of our art forms, even by the powers of the interweb, it feels like a very isolated place but at the same time you can feel suffocated too.
And yes a good portion of us are anti-war and our national identity prides itself on being anti-nuclear and not afraid to stand up to the ‘big boys'(in this case the governments of Australia and the US). There is a rise in the right however (though in NZer terms only, we find it shocking that the US Democratic party is to the right of our right of centre party, National) and I am willing to bet that they will win the next election (if only because Labour has been in for three terms and are making a bit of a hash of it in these last few years). We have a system of government called Mixed Member Proportional, which is kind of the same system as they have in Germany, so every vote counts (it’s not compulsory to vote, but it is to register and we vote by ticking a box with a felt tip pen). It means that no party can get away with much and are reliant on coalitions and legislation can pass very, very slowly.
I should add a disclaimer – this is my experience of living in Wellington, NZ for all of the 28 years of my life (although I’m in the UK on my OE right now). I’ve never lived in the States so I can’t answer whether your friend is right or wrong about her assumption on NZ being a better place. I’d maybe suggest that she goes there in Winter for a few months and see if she likes it – that would be the best test.
Yes there is racism and classicism, although a lot of people would deny it, I have no answer to that. 2nd gen, like me, tend to be fully assimilated and in general, I haven’t seen many ethnicities keeping to themselves in communities as I do here in the UK.
I’m sure I’ve killed the conversation and have gone completely off topic (and I have a script to write). But if you are interested in the last 2 years of identity upheaval in NZ, MoS, then I recommend you check out Public Address which is an excellent current affairs/OpEd blog and for an Asian political perspective click onto Tse Ming Mok’s blog Yellow Peril on the site.
It’s just a lull! I know I learnt a lot from your contributions. The interesting thing is there are all these kiwis here at SM – NvM, tash, yourself, any others I missed – who have added their interesting thoughts to the mix – I would never have thought there were so many.