Indian Enough For You? Bollywood and the Oscars

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Following on Siddhartha’s discussion of the “Desi Angle” question, there’s an insightful piece in the Indian Express by Shubhra Gupta (thanks, SP) on a related question: is it possible that the only foreign films that have a chance at getting nominated for the Oscars are those that register as completely “other” to the West? This year, India’s official choice, Rang de Basanti, didn’t make the top 10, while the Canadian-financed Deepa Mehta film Water, did. (The final nominees will be announced next week.)

But Paint It Yellow/Saffron (that’s what its English-subtitled version [of Rang de Basanti] is called . . . didn’t travel too far down the road to the Oscars for that exact same reason: confused, contemporary youth exist all over the world. To a foreign viewer, the film is not ‘Indian’ enough, not in the same way as, say, a Water is: it is also, and this is not a well-known fact, very strongly reminiscent of Canadian film Jesus Of Montreal, in which a group of actors’ lives change drastically as they put on a passion play.

Incarcerated widows in a pre-Independence Indian ‘ashram’. Oooh, that’s Indian. Where else would you find little girls and beautiful young women and old crones with tragic backstories and cruelly shaven heads? It’s another matter that even today, Vrindavan’s widows lead lives of quiet desperation. It’s also another matter that major portions of the film had to be shot in Sri Lanka, which masquerades as Varanasi. But Water has the backdrop of the British ‘raj’, the horror of child marriage and ‘sati’, and brutal oppression. Can’t get better, can it? (link)

Gupta is right on many counts here. Rang de Basanti does have urban, middle-class kids speaking liberal amounts of English (as well as a white girl, speaking Hindi). What she’s overlooking, of course, is that while Rang de Basanti is a lot of fun, it just isn’t that serious a film. It doesn’t have the sense of gravity or “prestige” that makes a film a plausible Oscar contender. A much better choice, by far, would have been Omkara — which has the three A’s: it’s Arty, “Authentic” (though still legible to western audiences, via Othello), and most importantly, Adult. (I often feel that NRIs or ABDs should pick India’s official Oscar selections, since the Board that currently makes this selection clearly has no idea what it’s doing. Paheli?)

Still, I fear that the three Indian films that have reached the nomination phase over the years — Mother India, Salaam, Bombay, and Lagaan — do all fit a pattern: they focus on desperate poverty. While this is undeniably an important (and continuing) part of Indian society, it’s sad that only the exotic, impoverished India of street urchins or rural desperation is likely to make an Oscar-worthy film.

Someone might object: why should Indians care about the Oscars? No Satyajit Ray film was ever nominated (though I must admit I don’t know how many of his films were officially submitted). And isn’t this is the same Academy that gave Best Picture to A Terrible Bore A Beautiful Mind? But, whether or not it’s justified, there always seems to be a great deal of interest in the Indian media about the Oscars — despite rampant evidence that Americans simply don’t get Indian cinema.

Perhaps we should start our own awards? The Mutinies?

223 thoughts on “Indian Enough For You? Bollywood and the Oscars”

  1. American wild west recast into an Indian setting

    An American wild west movies are recast from Japanese……the circle goes on and on, isn’t it.

    One of the earliest western-type movie is Akira Kurosawa’s Seven Samurai and even earlier Samurai movies.

  2. That’s a lotta comments, and I’m chiming in late here, but the Oscars people have notoriously awful taste. They especially love movies about poor suffering children, no matter where they originate. A few years ago I saw the short-listed shorts and animation up for awards. About half were melodramas about poor suffering children. The final nominees were about 80% poor suffering children, and the winner in the short film category was a poor-suffering-children extravaganza called “The Wasp,” from Britain. (By some miracle, the winner in the animation category was “Ryan,” an excellent movie about adults.) So any (non-Hollywood feature) movie, set in any country, is likelier to win an Oscar if it’s about poor suffering children. “Water” fits the bill.

  3. Sholay had nothing to do with John Wayne. I take offense at that statement. Actually, Sholay was more than your average western. That’s why its Sholay.

    That’s why the Ramayana sucks. I had had enough of boy scout clark-kent when I was 8 years old. Real gentlemen prefer the Mahabharata.

  4. That’s why the Ramayana sucks. I had had enough of boy scout clark-kent when I was 8 years old. Real gentlemen prefer the Mahabharata.

    Even with its excessive emphasis on Yudhisthir’s point of view? Although it’s still better than forcing a faithful wife to withstand the test of fire, the loads of explicit moralizing from Y in the end—when the Pandavas are each told their faults before they die—really put me off.

    <

    p> Writing Mahabharata over from say Bhima’s point of view would be such an interesting exercise!

  5. Sorry, dude, but Sholay was exactly like every average western ever made, except that Gabbar Singh is way cooler than any movie villain in any language ever!

    Personally, I prefer the Mahabharata too. Where else can a total wheeler-dealer like Krishna be held up as the ultimate hero? 😉

    Seriously though, think about the contrast between “realism” in Indian mythology, and in Indian movies. If just one desi movie could capture half the grittiness of the Mahabharata, I’d be sold. And so would the rest of the world.

    Whether realism is actually worth pursuing in a movie is a different issue.

  7. That’s the tragedy of versimilitude for you. When its too much, people just shut down and don’t do anything. But when its pseudo-realism, designed to put asses in seats, its obvious that the director thinks the audience is that much stupid. Realism has a place, just not in the colorful land of bollywood. You can’t talk about realism with backup dancers and white trash rockettes in the background.

  8. Writing Mahabharata over from say Bhima’s point of view would be such an interesting exercise!

    M.T. Vasudeva Nair retold the Mabharata from Bhima’s point of view in Randamoozham (Malayalam).

    There’s been a lot of experimentation with the Mahabharata in contemprary Indian literature. I guess by now its been written from everyone’s point of view. Shivaji Savant wrote it from Karna’s POV in Mrityunjaya (Marathi), Pratibha Ray from Draupadi’s POV in Yajnaseni. Narendra Kohli wrote an excellent view-neutral account in Mahasamar (hindi). Lesser know stories from the Mahabharata have also been explored, such as that of Yayati, in V.S. Khadekar’s eponymous novel (Marathi).

  10. Neale

    Then there were the lite moves – about the football player/coach (early Anil Kapoor?), You’re thinking of Raj Kiran and Hip Hip Hooray, a remake of To Sir with Love.

    the comedy about 3 geezers and their lady friend. I am forgetting the names.

    Shaukeen – A.K. Hangal, Utpal Dutt and Ashok Kumar. The lady was Rati Agnihotri and her beau was Mithun.

    Kush: he play of light in “Kagaaz Ke Phool” is a work of a genius like Guru Dutt. Actually of cinematographer V. K. Murthy, whose detailed interview (PDF) can be found here.

    There were quite a few brilliant Kannada film makers as well (not just the Hindi film makers from Karnataka like Shyam Benegal, Guru Dutt etc). I am referring to folks like Shankar Nag, Girish Kasaravalli etc.

    The past few years have been rather good to mainstream Hindi cinema, if one only looked. Consider these films for example; Main Madhuri Dixit banna chahti hoon, Company, Waisa Bhi Hota Hain Part II, Sehar, Teen Deewarein, etc. These do not fit the stereotype mentionned by many in the posts above. There are many more of this type.

  11. Realism has a place, just not in the colorful land of bollywood. You can’t talk about realism with backup dancers and white trash rockettes in the background.

    That’s why I started off by talking about fairy tales and such. I think it is possible to have a realistic construct (that doesn’t insult the audience’s intelligence) in a fantastical story. Plus, because the story is fantastical, it can incorporate the Bollywood song-and-dance trope without losing credibility.

    And so I’ve come full circle…and will indulge my need for “realism” by watching something trashy and Hollywood. Like The Hitcher.

  12. Thanks Kush!!

    Oh, Add Aparna Sen’s 36 Chowringee Lane. It will haunt you for next 10 years.

    I told you the list of par-excellent work is not small for Indian cinema, sure the majority can be mundane, but then that is true for anywhere.

  13. Thanks Quizman. For some reason i could remember where i saw these movies in Bombay but i could not remember the names 🙂

    There is one more Quizman that I remember – where Deepti Naval (?) goes door-to-door selling detergent when the film begins. Last one , I promise.

  14. Kush:

    Mine would be 1) Sholay, 2) Kagaaz Ki Phool, 3) Bimal Roy’s Devdas, 4) Bobby, 5) Do Ankh Bara Haath, 6) Pakeezah, 7) Bombay, 8) Shri 420, 9) AB’s original Deewar, 10) Masoom, 11) Ankur (I already over 10. Add another 10 movies by Satyajit Ray only – that is just a start)

    Great list. I’d also like to Govind Nihalani’s big three: Aakrosh, Ardh Satya and Droh Kaal – some of the most intense movies in India cinema.

    Also Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro.

  15. Realism has a place, just not in the colorful land of bollywood. You can’t talk about realism with backup dancers and white trash rockettes in the background.

    What does the phrase “white trash” refer to?

  16. Hema, I hope you’ve seen Children of Men, because that what you’re describing talking about realism in an imaginary construct.

    Star Wars has no social message. Children of Men doesn’t have a social message. Dont’ tack one on to your film to garner respect (Crash, RDB).

    Speaking of Hollywood, have y’all seen C.R.A.P.? http://youtube.com/watch?v=V1LiJuWV5mw

  17. There is one more Quizman that I remember – where Deepti Naval (?) goes door-to-door selling detergent when the film begins. Last one , I promise.

    Chashme Buddoor. Thats like India’s American Pie 😉 .

  18. I’d also like to Govind Nihalani’s big three: Aakrosh, Ardh Satya and Droh Kaal – some of the most intense movies in India cinema.

    I agree.

    Ardh Satya is incredibly intense movie, even much more raw than Omkara.

  20. I’m saying this as a lifelong American, so I apologize for any myopia. But doesn’t every country do this with foreign film? We’re more likely to promote those films that confirm our sentiments about a place. Look at the American films that do well overseas: not intimately-drawn character studies, but big-budget violent and sexual blow-em-ups. That’s our image. More importantly, that’s the image that foreign audiences want to see. A film about poverty and desperation in the United States doesn’t do well in most of the world

    Totally true!

    Shwarzenegger is a big hit in India.

    Personal anecdote;

    An Indian man once said to me, “in India there is love. In America there is only sex.”

    I asked him when he had been to American and which part… his answer…

    “I haven’t”.

    Then I asked so how do you know what America is like?

    He said, “from T.V.”

  21. Hema, I hope you’ve seen Children of Men, because that what you’re describing talking about realism in an imaginary construct.

    Saw it, and liked it too, although it’s debatable that Children of Men does not have a social message. There’s certainly enough implicit preaching re: immigrants’ rights, totalitarian government, etc.

    At any rate, I think we’re basically in agreement. I agree that there is no need to add a social message to a movie, just to make it more “relevant.” I found “Crash” really condescending, for example…and I would add “Monsoon Wedding” to the list of movies that took themselves too seriously not to have some sort of message.

    But you know what? Almost every non-desi I know loved “Monsoon Wedding”…

  22. the Oscars people have notoriously awful taste. They especially love movies about poor suffering children

    So typically callous of the Bollywood crowd. No wonder India is Hell on earth for 100s of millions of children. Bonded child labor, chronic malnutrition, child marriage, child prostitution and so on.

  23. the Oscars people have notoriously awful taste. They especially love movies about poor suffering children

    I would think this would be a good thing?

    Doesn’t it show some interest in the portrayal of the realities of life for many children worldwide? A willingness to promote that portrayal so that some attention and hopefully action be directed towards those less fortunate than themselves?

  26. Friday night and I’m the only one commenting. I need to get a life! Hee hee hee.

  27. Mistress of Spices, I wholeheartedly agree with you on 15 Park Avenue. I cringed throughout the movie, with its sickeningly predictable dialogue, the awful doctor going on about “my reality is different from your reality”… the whole thing was intolerable. As for the post-sex scenes between Rahul Bose and wife, the less said the better. To this day I feel a cringe coming on when I think of Black and 15 Park Avenue. At least masala doesn’t pretend to be anything better. But these so-called serious and insightful movies fall so short of the mark that they are simply ludicrous.

  28. Looks like you and I are the only ones home on a Friday night, SK.

    I have to admit, I liked BLACK.

  29. But doesn’t every country do this with foreign film? We’re more likely to promote those films that confirm our sentiments about a place. Look at the American films that do well overseas: not intimately-drawn character studies, but big-budget violent and sexual blow-em-ups. That’s our image. More importantly, that’s the image that foreign audiences want to see.

    Last year’s top 10 domestic grossers are all either action films or cute animation flicks (link). I don’t think there’s a single movie in the top 50 that can remotely be described as an intimate character study. So action movies doing well IMO has more to do with universal public taste than sterotypes about the US. Lets just say that Hollywood has discovered what sells and is sticking to it.

    OTOH, I am willing to admit I don’t like foreign movies that are too much like the domestic movies I watch (I think someone made this point above). I hated Crouching Tiger. I thought it was just Bollywood with flying people.

  30. Kush sarji, tusi great ho. Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro is a great choice. Everyone should see Om Puri’s classic “Oae Dropdi ke hum bhi share-holder hai” line.

  32. I found Omkara a much better movie then Rang De Basanti. I do not think the nomination choices have anything to do with poverty. The Indian culture is known to the western people very well.

  33. There is one more Quizman that I remember – where Deepti Naval (?) goes door-to-door selling detergent when the film begins. Last one , I promise.

    Chashme Buddoor, which remains to me, the greatest Hindi film ever made. I’ve seen it around 33 times. 🙂 And everytime, I find something new to laugh about.

  35. Mine would be 1) Sholay, 2) Kagaaz Ki Phool, 3) Bimal Roy’s Devdas, 4) Bobby, 5) Do Ankh Bara Haath, 6) Pakeezah, 7) Bombay, 8) Shri 420, 9) AB’s original Deewar, 10) Masoom, 11) Ankur (I already over 10. Add another 10 movies by Satyajit Ray only – that is just a start)

    Nice. To randomly add 10 more – restricting to Hindi and films not mentioned yet:

    1)Katha 2)Ijaazat 3)Khandhar 4)Madhumati 5)Khamosi 6)Abhimaan 7)Mahal 8)Mirch Masala 9)Woh Kaun Thi 10)Andaz Apna Apna

  37. Glaring omission – Sanjiv Kumar movies.

    Sholay. Gabbar, yahe haat mujhe de de.

    Time Magazine has put Mani Ratnam’s Nayagan on all time 100-movies. I am going to get through netflix next week.

  39. though I must admit I donÂ’t know how many of his films were officially submitted

    I vaguely recall reading that none of Ray’s films was ever submitted. There was some discussion about it around the time when he got the lifetime. I am not sure though.

    Google yields this:

    says filmmaker Anup Kurian (Manasarovar). “The Producers Association (which recommends Indian films for Academy Awards) did not consider Satyajit Ray, Mrinal Sen or Adoor Gopalakrishnan films Oscar-worthy. Films such as Pather Panchali, Apur Sansar, Aparajito, Charulata, Bhuvan Shome or Mathilukal were ignored.”The selection process is skewed,” agrees Subhakar, adman and filmmaker.

    Not conclusive. Ray did win NBR’s best foreign film award for both Pather Panchali and Apur Sansar.

  42. but Salaam Bombay is a good film) is the regionalism that unfortunately comes into play. inevitably there are always discussions on language and it does seem that hindi/bollywood films feel entitled over other language films to be nominated.

    it ain’t so, as brown on this thread has pointed out the selection process.

    FYI: From wikipedia entry for Nayagan

    The film also went on to win an Indian National Award for Kamal Haasan for his brilliant performance. Nayagan was nominated by India as its entry for the Best Foreign Language Film for the Academy Awards in 1987.

  45. I’ve heard Mira Nair’s Salaam Bombay singled out as depicting that tiny street urchin everyone seems to want to run away from…

    but what about Monsoon Wedding? I loved that movie, did anyone think it deserved an Oscar nomination? I did. I mean if Lagaan got nominated, this movie really deserved to be.

    For me a major problem with Hindi films is the subtitling and translation…I think if they accounted more for Indians who want to watch their movies but who don’t speak Hindi then I’d enjoy watching them…there must be a growing group of non Hindi fluent Indians around the world. Subtitles would be great!

  46. List of India’s official entries to the Oscars

    Some really atrocious choices stand out: Henna, Parinda, Indian, Jeans, Devdas.

  47. List of India’s official entries to the Oscars

    Thanks. Wondering about the missing years.

    Didn’t the Paranjpes’ ( Winnie or Sai ) make a TV series too that was hilarious?

    Ados Pados? Used to come on Thursday nights. Amol Palekar was in it. And the Friday night was for Yeh Jo Hai Zindagi. Good old DD comedies.

  50. Chashme Buddoor, which remains to me, the greatest Hindi film ever made.

    Chashme Buddoor are persian words, via urdu. It highlights the fact that Bollywood basically is derived from muslim mughal culture. Lucknawi andaaz and all that.