From our News Tab we got word that late on Thursday the U.S. Attorney’s Office in Atlanta unsealed and indictment against a Pakistani American student at Georgia Tech, as well as another Atlanta-based U.S. citizen who was arrested a few days ago in Dhaka. From CNN:
A Georgia Tech university student has been indicted for material support of terrorism, and another Atlanta-area man has been arrested in Bangladesh in connection with the case, authorities said Thursday.
Though the U.S. Attorney’s Office in Atlanta on Thursday unsealed an indictment against Syed Ahmed, 21, details remained sealed. A grand jury indicted him March 23, the same day he was arrested.
“The charge against Mr. Ahmed is serious and involves national security and will be prosecuted with that in mind,” U.S. Attorney David Nahmias said in a news release.
Ahmed is not accused of committing a terrorist act; he is charged only with providing material support, the federal prosecutor said…On Monday, Ehsanul Islam Sadequee, 19, was arrested in the Bangladeshi capital of Dhaka, according to his sisters. He was handed over to the FBI and put on a plane to New York on Thursday, the federal source said. [Link]
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p>We have to remember that grand juries will usually indict anyone with a pulse. More details about the actual indictment will hopefully follow in the next several weeks and we will try to keep an eye on it. I am assuming that this will turn out to be more than just part of the “taking pictures while brown” phenomenon.
Ahmed is studying mechanical engineering at Georgia Tech. He is a naturalized American citizen and the papers detailing his arrest last month on charges related to terrorism have his parents shocked and surprised….Ahmed’s family suspects a videotape of their son made of a building, is what authorities are suspicious of. The family reportedly allowed federal agents to take computer information from their son’s room. [Link]
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p>The article about the incident as reported by the Atlanta Journal Constitution goes a step further and adds some illuminating personal details about Ahmed. The details really resonated with me because of their source. I can imagine this being the type of ordinary family that any of us could come from. Ahmed’s mother and sister seem to implore you to understand that he is a good kid who had been showing only hints of a conservative streak. Maybe I am reading more into the story than is there, or maybe the journalist has simply crafted the article just so, but I can almost feel a touch of regret in their words, like part of them wonders if he is in fact guilty of whatever he is accused of:
Ahmed’s sister and mother spoke Wednesday from a couch at the family’s large home near Dawsonville, where they have lived for five years. They described Syed Ahmed as a likable but reserved young man who was trying to find himself.
They seemed bewildered while talking about the family ordeal, with his mother alternating between smiles and tears.
“He’s very brilliant, very caring,” his sister said. “He has a good sense of humor. He likes to eat. He’s very good working…”Samia Ahmed said her brother’s interest in Islam had been growing. “He’s religious and liked the simple life,” she said. “He wants us to abide by the rules. He isn’t against anyone; he just doesn’t want us to lose our faith.”
Lately, he was getting more interested in Islamic studies and was trying to teach himself Arabic so he could read the Koran.
“He was trying to learn everything,” she said. “He’s still very innocent in his mind. He’s still a child…”Asked what her son thought about the current troubles in the Middle East, Faiqa Ahmed said, “We don’t talk political stuff. We are ladies.”[Link]
Another issue in this is the indictment of the second man, Ehsanul Islam Sadequee, who was arrested in Bangladesh. He better be on his way back to the U.S. right now. Some lawyers may want to comment on this but I would think that it would be illegal for the U.S. to allow him, as a U.S. Citizen, to be interrogated by Bangladeshi authorities, after the U.S. indicted him. At alt.muslim.com Naeem Mohaiemen asks the same question.
Is this a case of extraordinary rendition? Bangladesh currently has a Rightist-Islamist coalition government with one of the worst human rights records in its 35 year history. The country was named “most dangerous for journalists” last year by Committee to Protect Journalists…<
p>Anyone familiar with Bangladesh knows that there is a high possibility that the security forces could torture Ehsanul to coerce a “confession”. We have had numerous cases in the recent past of wanton torture, including the Hindu student who was accused of sending a threatening e-mail to the leader of the opposition. [Link]
CAIR is asking the U.S. government to reveal the status of Sadequee:
The Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) said the family of 19-year-old Ehsanul Islam Sadequee reported that he was taken into custody April 17 by armed security personnel in Dhaka, Bangladesh’s capital city.
Sadequee was born in Fairfax, Va., is a resident of Atlanta, Ga., and has a sister in Michigan. His family says he was visiting Bangladesh in order to get married and has been ill recently. They suspect he was targeted by Bangladeshi authorities based on information from U.S. law enforcement agencies that have been periodically interviewing family members in this country since August of last year. [Link]
and
are totally silly. In Franklin’s time, America was full of people loyal to a dominant naval power which shortly after his death sacked Washington, D.C. and burned down the White House. The British king was making the exact same arguments about security vs. freedom that you guys are.
Franklin was articulating a vision of America despite the ability of an enemy to destroy cities– the military and counter-intel strength to defend a free land, the whole point of the American Revolution, not the King George method of disappearing people without charges or trial.
Manish,
Do you want to live in those times.
18th Century had a different context, present has a different one.
Irrespective of what Benjamin Frankin said for a significant time justice flowed from the barrel of gun (especially on frontiers).
Anyway as Scott Adams says
and
Regards
I want to live under the Constitution.
. In Franklin’s time, America was full of people loyal to a dominant naval power which shortly after his death sacked Washington, D.C. and burned down the White House. The British king was making the exact same arguments about security vs. freedom that you guys are.
Franklin was articulating a vision of America despite the ability of an enemy to destroy cities– the military and counter-intel strength to defend a free land, the whole point of the American Revolution, not the King George method of disappearing people without charges or trial.
I think comparing the Brits of 1700s – early 1800s with Al-qaeda is a big stretch. They have had Habeas corpus from 1679.
All these talks about saving the “freedoms” even while a couple of cities are ‘nuked’ sounds nice to hear.. Is it pragmatic?.
One major terrorist attack, you see the PATRIOT act and its renewal without much of an opposition. I doubt the percentage of “overthrown” arrests by the Bush administration by the Judiciary. They claim a high percentage of success. Even the case trumped up by CAIR, ACLU ended up with the accused pleading guilty. link
Let’s take a hypothetic case. Al-qaeda attacks US with WMDs successfully taking out a few cities. And then the govt. introduces draconian measures. Do you support those measures at that time?. If yes, why won’t you support the same measures now to prevent the attacks. If no, what is the solution you offer?. I’m against taking out liberties in the name of security. But I’d like to know how you solve this issue. I think to beleive Al-qaeda/ related terrorists have no intention / capacity to inflict harm would be a big mistake.
What you describe is a different issue. If I am detained, I’d rather in US federal custody than anywhere else.
Not if you are being detained for terrorism related charges.
The US government indeed has a terrible record on these cases. The Government is not living up to the standards set in the Bill of Rights and in the laws enacted by the government itself.
The failure rate of the US government in these terror related prosecutions is mind boggling. They usually start with serious terrorism charges, accompanied by a high profile Justice Department press conference and accompanied by hysterical breaking news on Faux etc. with expert comments from Steve Emerson (MSNBC) and the rest.
However a few months later, all the charges are usually dropped, or never brought up (usually), and we are usually left with some minor immigration violations or other minor non terrorism related charges. This has happened over and over again. More times than I care to list them here and for those who are incredulous you can google the ‘high profile’ arrests and see how they turned out.
My first reaction to these arrests now is presuming incompetence of the Justice Department unless proven otherwise. For anybody who keeps track of these cases, I am not sure if any reasonable person can reach a different conclusion.
You have to wonder about why the Justice Department bungles up so many of these cases. Its always a big embarrassment for the government and it tarnishes the record of the prosecutor and the investigators in such cases.
AMD(55#)
I don’t think you would like to go in Indian Police custody. Don’t know about other counteries though.
Regards
Manish (53#),
I agree, I am just wary of mistaking quotes and rhetoric as a basis for policy. I also concede that issue of Law and Law enforcement in general (much less that pertaining to US) is not my area of expertise.
Regards
I don’t think you would like to go in Indian Police custody.
State prisons in the US are pretty horrific too.
AMD (58#)
I have heard that, but what I am saying is that in India, you do not want to cross cops.
Regards
I have heard that, but what I am saying is that in India, you do not want to cross cops
Gaurav: I see what you are saying, but I would not use India as a measuring stick. Comparing the US with a country like India sets the bar so low that almost any institution in the US will look great when compared to the insitutions in India.
Also, I dont know how much you know about state prisons in the US, but the situation in state prisons in pretty sad.
AMD (60#)
Ofcourse I was setting it low! it was just for purpose of rhetoric,basically I was replying to this
(Which I assume was also more or less rhetoric )
But I do agree that Since American system fares better than India and Indian system fare better than China is not an excuse to overlook or explain away violations by law enforcement. Ultimately democracy requires unceasing vigilance.
Regards
The entire U.S. airspace was shut down the morning of 9/11. Do you support extending that measure indefinitely?
Our policy is set by tyrants for political gain by playing to cowards in suburbs not even affected by terrorism, and it’s mooting the entire point of this country’s founding. We’ve turned into England circa 1700’s.
And this argument is a total strawman. We don’t deter nukes in cities by throwing gardeners in jail for years at a time and then exporting them to Egypt to be tortured. Law enforcement needs no more powers, it needs more precision.
I think comparing the Brits of 1700s – early 1800s with Al-qaeda is a big stretch.
They’re entirely different phenomena, but presumably, on this blog, we could acknowledge that British colonialism had some extremely negative qualities?
Manish writes:
So do we. If the Bush Admin had subverted the Constitution, then the Democrats and big-Media would have fried and eaten them for breakfast. If anything, this administration has been most closely watched by the opposition since the dawn of America.
See, this is where the Democrats erred in the last election (and paid the price). Their contention was that terrorism was a problem largely confined to large cities, especially on the two coasts(blue states). Middle America (red states), they believed should not have to care much because of low density of population. The problem was that they focussed solely on human deaths from terrorism. They forgot that we live in a closely linked, globalised world, where events reverbate around in internet time.
When 911 happened, 3000 people died in NYC. But the economic effects hit all of America and the rest of the world. Plumbers and electricians in Indiana who had invested in the stock market lost their shirts when the market tanked after 911 (until 2003). Home Depots in Ohio cut their workforce in half. Walmarts in Louisiana cut employee benefits. Software engineers in Bangalore were willing to take paycuts to keep their jobs. In fact, New York city bounced back very quickly (by mid-2002), but for the rest of America to recover from 911 related economic downturn took much longer (mid 2003). Every time Al-Zawahiri makes a threat on Al-Jazeera, the subway riders of New York feel apprehensive, but due to increased security they live. However, oil prices shoot up and middle America ends up paying $3 for gasoline. Gold shoots up, the dollar falls. Credit spreads tighten. Interest rates go up. People of all kinds, all over the world, are effected.
If God forbid, a WMD attack takes place in any city in America, surely hundreds of thousands will die. But the economy will go down so fast that at least 100 million people in America and upto half-a-billion people in the world will see severe economic hardship for years.
We live in an inter-dependant world. There’s no such thing as suburbs, cities when it comes to terrorism.
M. Nam
To be honest with you guys, I think the only way to defuse Islamic terrorism at the core level is for mosques and Muslim religious leaders worldwide to issue a huge, united, joint “fatwa” against Al-Qaeda and declare them (and any of their supporters, both “actual” and “armchair”) to be heretics and blasphemers. I know some Islamic religious authorities have already done so (I can’t remember exactly which groups, though), but it needs to be done on a massive scale and in a united voice. Non-Muslims would have no credibility in these matters from the perspective of the jihadists (and their motives would be regarded as suspect), so the Ummah and its associated religious heirarchy needs to take this measure themselves.
Discredit Al-Qaeda’s jihadist ideology as fundamentally incompatible with Islam, and you cut off the problem at the root.
Not much hope of that happening when it is in the mosques around the world this message of hate is being preached:
Discredit Al-Qaeda’s jihadist ideology as fundamentally incompatible with Islam, and you cut off the problem at the root.
Jai,
Any ideology/system fails when it runs out of money/ funding? That is the only true and tested way. Any other way is just diversionary tactics while you drain them of their money. I am not saying thing original – even for Islamist terrorism, there were serious of articles in NYT on trying dry the funding. It is quite complicated because of the banking system (hawala) and powerful underwriters. Fatwa and all is like writing comments on SM – nice but of no real significane unless grand Ayatollahs from Iran are involved. Examples: Fall of the Iron curtain, Leftist movements in Western Europe in 70s (Red Brigade), Anarchists in early 20th century.
Another example: In the end Germany ran out of oil and gas, and raw materials in WW II even though their arms (planes, tanks) and armies were superior.
Correction: there were series of articles in NYT on trying to dry the
To be honest with you guys, I think the only way to defuse Islamic terrorism at the core level is for mosques and Muslim religious leaders worldwide to issue a huge, united, joint “fatwa” against Al-Qaeda and declare them (and any of their supporters, both “actual” and “armchair”) to be heretics and blasphemers .. Discredit Al-Qaeda’s jihadist ideology as fundamentally incompatible with Islam, and you cut off the problem at the root.
You are on a very shaky ground if you follow that method. Al-qaeda is quoting from Quran and Hadiths, Spare some time to go through those references and they are perfectly valid.. If you read the statements of Bin-laden (or is it Zawahiri??) he compares the Iraq invasion to the sack of Baghdad (by Hulagu Khan in 1258 A.D ??).. These guys have a long history going back to 6th century.. You can’t beat them on religion.. There is no use in doing that.. Why do you want to legitimise such stuff. What if tommorrow Organistaion of Islamic Countries declares “global jihad” as a valid tool, do you accept that?.
Actually the US economy in general was in a recession already in 2001. Stock market fell due to the “irrational exuberence” of the dot com bubble. Economist now say that the US economic recession began in March 2001
Home Depot’s stock actually went up until mid 2002. I am not sure why/how 9/11 can affect HD. After the dot com bubble the next “irrational exuberance” happened in the housing market which is still going on. HD was a direct benifitiory of the housing BOOM (which is almost unprecedented).
I dont know enough about WalMart.
This is just a result of Dot com bubble bursting. I will give you an example. Lucent Tech’s revenue’s have shrunked DOWN by 70% from the high’s of DOT Com bubble (also their employees have gone down by 70%).
Kush T,
Exactly. So get them involved. Which, probably, they won’t do unless they perceive a direct threat to their power base (or Iran as a whole) from Al-Qaeda.
With regards to your other comments re: finances — perhaps the problem requires a multi-pronged approach ? One can all these steps (and any others deemed constructive) simultaneously ?
Ponniyin Selvan,
Which is why the problem, ideally, should be solved “internally” rather than by the rest of us. If what you are saying is true, then any organised attempt by non-Muslims to attack these concepts will be interpreted as an attack on Islam as a whole, and would therefore risk uniting neutral and “friendly” Muslims everywhere with their jihadist co-religionists, as happened with the recent Danish cartoon controversy.
There are, of course, certain historical precedents for certain non-Muslim religious groups to attack and debunk the aforementioned problematic Islamic tenets (as any student of the last 500 years of North Indian history would know), but the issue is regarding who is prepared to step up to the plate in our present-day scenario and consequently face the onslaught which it would probably risk triggering. These things require serious guts, not to mention the fact that they can rapidly escalate into extremely dangerous situations, with severe consequences for any groups concerned (along with their allies and nearest-and-dearest).
Not for the faint-hearted 😉
One more economic fact. Right after the sep.11 2001 terrorist attack, prices of GOLD has steadily gone UP. GOLD precious metal (at NYMEX) in March 2001 : $265.00 GOLD precious metal (at NYMEX) in March 2003 : $365.00 GOLD precious metal (at NYMEX) in April 2006 : $620.00
The theory here is as usual, GOLD a hedge against inflation and safe investment in times of political turmoil.
Not for the faint-hearted 😉
Jai,
A few minutes ago, I got a dossier, and the United Nations wants proudly to announce that we want to appoint you as the Under Secretary for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs for UN, something akin to Karen Hughes’ position in current US administration to undertake the battle against Islamist Jihad.
You knowledge of Mughal Empire was the deal clincher. However, we need to ask one thing: Are you in secretly in love with Ekta Kapoor. No problema, but we still need to be clear in our dossier for you. We can even help you on the regard.
You can come out of annonymity to accept our offer. Please do consider us. Hope you will find our offer a worthy challenge.
With deep regards,
Kofi Annon
If it starts to effect us nonmuslims, we will push for hardline solutions from our politicos. Most people dont care if muslims dont want their toilets not oriented towards kaba. It is when they start to (a) Muslims in nonmuslim countries demand nonsense protection under the name of religion, be it drivers license picture, or asking some one not to make cartoons, discuss anything remotely islamic and on and on. Incidentaly the root of the controversy was the multi-culti attempt by danes to make a childrens book about islam to start in preschool, which some moron made a fuss about causing the project to be shelved and a fellow suggested some other cartoons for the book(only 2 media sources reported this…talk about low quality media coverage on TV) WSJ, and hitchens in an interview. (b) muslims in islamic countries exporting terrorism.
I could care less what some one does in their private homes/cultural organization religious or otherwise and i expect the same. Its them who in issues covered in (a) demand special treatment and make it an external issue or ofcourse pick a fight and make it external issue.
Kush T aka Kofi Annan,
I am afraid I am going to have to decline your offer, unless I can be a suave undercover agent like James Bond and/or have a hot, leggy female sidekick who can beat the crap out of anyone and looks good in multiple disguises (like Jennifer Garner in Alias).
My disparaging comments about Star Plus serials should have indicated that I am not a big fan of Ms Ekta Kapoor, unless you think this was all an ingenious double-bluff where I deflect suspicions about my volcanic desire for her by constantly objecting to her work……
Anyway, fix me up with Angelina Jolie or Monica Bellucci, and we can talk. Or Celina Jaitley if she’s available. Hubba hubba.
Yours sincerely, Ladies Love Cool Jai aka LLCoolJai.
RC,
Quickly… totally get that the economy was in recession before 911. However, it was just crawling back up and 911 brought it down again. Of course, Enron followed. It was a perfect storm.
And I get the part about gold prices and their link to inflation as well.
However – the point remains. Terrorist acts in cities will reverbate across the country from an economic viewpoint. There’s not much debate to that.
Gotta go.
M. Nam
Jai,
Which is why the problem, ideally, should be solved “internally” rather than by the rest of us. If what you are saying is true, then any organised attempt by non-Muslims to attack these concepts will be interpreted as an attack on Islam as a whole, and would therefore risk uniting neutral and “friendly” Muslims everywhere with their jihadist co-religionists, as happened with the recent Danish cartoon controversy
I don’t think the rest of the world has “time” and “patience” to wait for enlightenment in Saudi Arabia.. And you expect the Danish society to pander to Arab morals. What next??.. Riots for using the name Muhammad not followed by PBUH (Peace Be Upon Him)..
Economic impacts are wildly inflated by a MSM looking to write a particular story that sells papers and a political party looking to deflect blame for an already weak economy. In the stock market, short sellers will sell for any reason at all: a HP earnings report, solar flares, Britney Spears gets the sniffles. Those going long will bid shares up for irrational reasons as well.
But if you look at the real economy, the impacts are limited. Nasdaq and the NYSE were up and running again in less than a week. The financial sector in Lower Manhattan is a very small portion of the GDP. The argument only makes sense if you’re arguing tipping point, but then you have to rigorously prove these things, not assert them based on sensationalist media.
In short, there’s no causality.
Ponniyin Selvan ,
It’s not just a Saudi Arabian problem (although they’re certainly the major cause behind the current “export” of their interpretation of Islam), it’s a global problem wherever there are sufficiently disgruntled Muslims who have jihadist leanings.
I’m not denying that “external intervention” is an inviable solution if the global Ummah is unable (or unwilling) to solve this problem themselves. As mentioned in the last paragraph of my post #71, it’s worth bearing in mind that there will be retaliation (on multiple levels) against any group who is perceived to be attacking Islam’s more controversial tenets. This doesn’t mean that such steps should not be taken, it just means that one should be fully aware of — and prepared for — the consequences.
With regards to your earlier points:
Ponniyin, it’s not about anyone ‘pandering to Arab morals.’ It’s a simple fact of humanity, you should tolerate others and not insult what they hold dear. As a Muslim, I don’t care if you go get drunk or whatever. It’s your life. If you’re going to draw prophets, well keep them to yourself and don’t spread them around to piss people off. Like I said, it’s your life, draw what you want and leave us out of it.
Freedom of expression is nothing w/o the freedom to offend. You are free to rebut those arguements but vandalism and burning tires on the street pisses others off. an Indian did not draw any of those cartoons, yet there were riots and call for murder by an elected rep in india? This is why it becomes an external issue.
A most kind and open minded view… perhaps you could ask the Arab/Muslim media to extend the same privilege to other faiths too ? Or is it another case of “do as I tell/order you, not as I do” ?
I found the jew holding the worlds businessmen hostage over holocaust funny…
Thanks Abhi, for keeping the spotlight on these important issues.
As the muslim media ever said something nice about non-muslim faith. Yet the other side has gone out of it ways to say that islam is are religon of peace and tolerance. I think we all know the answer to that.
PearlJamFan, you are rapidly descending into troll territory. Three of our simian staff have already advocated just banning you. Please check yourself before you wreck yourself.
SulaymanF
Ponniyin, it’s not about anyone ‘pandering to Arab morals.’ It’s a simple fact of humanity, you should tolerate others and not insult what they hold dear. As a Muslim, I don’t care if you go get drunk or whatever. It’s your life. If you’re going to draw prophets, well keep them to yourself and don’t spread them around to piss people off. Like I said, it’s your life, draw what you want and leave us out of it.
I don’t think it is a simple fact of humanity to respect to “religious morals” of 7th century.. What do you think about the hateful verses in the holy documents of Quran/Hadiths about polytheists/idolators/kafirs. And the glaring in your face message 5 times a day from the loudspeakers that claims “there is one no god but Allah and Mohammad is his prophet”. Isn’t it a simple fact of humanity to tolerate those polytheists/idolators and not to piss them off.. What do you think of the “arab governments” policies not to allow people to even bring magazines containing religious pictures let alone allowing “freedom of worship”.?
I would have taken the “politically correct” line of treating all faiths equal etc.. etc.. even a few years back when I was ignorant, not anymore.. You want the European society to pander to these backward religious sentiments of immigrants. These folks have a painful memory of pandering to “religious sentiments” and have fought hard to come out of it.. Read this …Jean-François, knight de la Barre (1745 – July 1st, 1766) was a French nobleman, famous for having been tortured and burnt at the stake for not having removed his hat before a Catholic procession. In France, he is a symbol of Christian religious intolerance, along with Jean Calas and Pierre-Paul Sirven…